I know I've said it before, but I never try to convince people in my life that COVID's serious anymore. It just always leaves me frustrated.
So, that said, my wife best friend just texted to say she's got COVID for the first time and she knows we "keep up with COVID" and wanted to ask some questions. Sure, no problem.
She was on a flight last weekend and asks if it's possible that she just tested positive now. We tell her that RAT's are supposedly around day 5-11 now, so that's totally possible.
She asks if we know what the workplace rules are for her, and sure we send her a link. She says that's not at all what her boss said, but OK.
She asks if it's even possible to not give her husband COVID. We go over ventilation, filtration, masks, etc and this is where it really starts to go off the rails. She's just like "Yeah, we're not doing any of that."
She asks if long COVID "is real" or if there's anything else she should know and we're like yeah, it is, there's a lot that's unknown. We're sending you some links about what is known with long COVID rates, the things to look out for, what you can try to do in the meantime, etc. and she reads it and goes "Ummm, yeah. That all looks super sketchy. If any of that were real I'm sure the news would be talking about it. I'm sorry but I think you guys have fallen for some hoax or something here. I have a fever, a runny nose and muscle aches. I'm going to take some Tylenol. We have a birthday party to attend tonight, a kid's party tomorrow and my boss wants me back at work on Monday. Thanks anyway."
I give up.
Our health messaging sucks, proven yet again.
They went out last night, maskless, "but outside for most of the time" so, therefore, obviously safe.
Today her and her husband decided to stay 6' away from each other because that guarantees he won't get it. Yes, they're hanging out together in the same room, but staying 6' apart.
It's been a while since someone I knew well shared all of their thoughts regarding COVID and it just baffles me how this is what people believe, but it goes to show we're probably never getting out of this mess. Plan accordingly in your life.
@BE oh man. This sounds so hard.
@BE with current work rules it seems almost pointless though. We have people in work coughing and splattering saying 'There's no point in testing because I had covid a few weeks ago and you test positive for 30 days' I just keep my 2 air filters on high, wear a mask and hope for the best.
You're not wrong at all. We need to control it both at work and at home in the end.
I might as well say this every day, but, we're just so far away from even beginning the process of fixing this.
@BE we have more people out with covid and other not-covid rsv (which I think is still covid) right now than at any other point in the last three years.
Yeah, once it reached the levels this winter that Jerome Powell's talking about it you know that business owners are concerned.
@BE @urbanfoxe Unfortunately, I suspect a lot of business owners are dealing with it by pressuring employees to come in anyway, and letting next week’s resulting outbreak be a problem for next week.
@lauraintheory @BE I don't work for a business I work for the biggest public school system in the world and that's scarily the attitude of our leaders too.
I debated whether it was even worth updating this thread, but, because you mentioned work rules and how pointless it all is, here we go...
She took Monday off of work and told her boss and HR that she had COVID. Both called her later that day and told her she had to be in at work on Tuesday. She's been in the rest of the week and at least as of yesterday she's still symptomatic.
Shocker, I know, but the husband got COVID, too. They convinced themselves that it wasn't the not isolating and just sitting 6' apart from each other and that he actually had it before then. He's also been at work all week.
@BE I'm out for 5 days that don't come out of my sick days now based on positive test. I feel fine except groggy head which is why I took the test. I'm home in my room wearing a mask but it's not easy to isolate in an apt.
Feel better soon!
Mask, ventilation and filtration. As much as possible for all if there's anyone else around.
I could almost see my brother saying this. Former liberal arts professor, as liberal as they come, etc. In other words, your basic over-educated NPR listener. But he's also the "Get over it" guy whenever I mention masking up in a public situation. Claims he hasn't had so much as a cold since pre-Covid. Oh, really. 🤨
@BE Liberals have been doing the denial thing for most of the pandemic at this point! I live in SF, which is better than most places in this regard … and it still isn’t good.
@BE Look, you made a valiant effort. I think that's the best any of us can do.
The sad thing is, it's hard not to let the dismissiveness affect relationships, isn't it?
I think it's frustrating to me at this point because I know that nearly everyone feels the same way they do, so I don't bother, but they reached out to *ask the questions* and then didn't want the answers. It's like falling into a trap that you fell into before. No one to blame but yourself.
@BE The answers were inconvenient, I suppose. That's what it comes down to for most, isn't it? They're receptive to input from those they know to be more knowledgeable, assuming that the response doesn't require actual effort or sacrifice.
And there, is the bottom line for so many things. Including, but not limited to, COVID and the climate crisis.
@BE Well, just tell her "Can't I talk to your husband?"
She's decided to infect her husband, might as well tell him what she's doing.
At this point I would simply tell everyone else she's about to infect. She's a bad person.
I guess I left out that the "We're not doing any of that" was after consulting him. He's apparently perfectly fine with being infected. I guess if there was something that required practically zero effort they might have attempted it.
@BE
1)The lack of reliable COVID information is intentional. I learned more about SARS-CoV-2 from SARS and MERS than I did from most contemporary research, much of which is utter garbage meant to justify a market for pharmaceuticals that have already been developed but have yet to be placed with a market, like the less than useless Remdesivir (as an antiviral monotherapy, at least; might help buttress a combo), or cytokine targeting therapies even though CKs aren't overly deterministic
@VeeRat
@BE Really sorry to hear this. Sounded like she was hoping you'd tell her something more reassuring, then shut down when it wasn't forthcoming. Hopefully her case is mild enough, she'll have the luxury of continuing to believe it's a hoax.
Yes, it's sadly that. I'll give a shred of credit that she took the time to test, but putting any effort into it beyond that was clearly a bridge too far. I definitely gave her too much credit to think that she wouldn't just take some Tylenol and go infect other people. Lesson learned. In all likelihood she will be fine from this infection and will go back to blissful ignorance, at least until the next one.
@BE this sounds to me like she wanted your answers to validate what she already decided, and didn't want to accept something different.
@BE
I feel your pain friend... but I'm sure you likely have helped many people think twice!
Just tonight I managed to convince my mom to wear an #N95 to an event she's attending. Some know and pretend not to. Some don't believe it. But some *will* come around... and they're worth it. We're all worth it.
That's an absolutely fabulous statement and congratulations on convincing your mom to mask up!
@BE Your experience captures so well the disconnect those of us who are well-informed re COvid feel, the impassable chasm between ourselves and the vast majority of people who have fallen for the minimizing & disinfo
Oligarch bros have done an extremely effective job w/ their propaganda, using our colleagues, friends, family to create massive peer pressure to conform to this break from reality.
@BE Thinking about the intentionally created & maintained pandemic mass delusion.
Folie a deux= 2 ppl with shared delusional system.
What do we call it when it's a mass delusion, with intense pressure to conform & keep quiet?
I'd forgotten I wrote this about her. My wife was telling me earlier in the week about how her husband's on strike(they live in LA) and won't wear a mask anywhere anymore, but it's mostly OK because "it's mutated so it can't kill people anymore."
She was bragging about how she'll still wear a mask to the grocery store and the doctor, because immunocompromised people need to be there...but nowhere else, I guess...My wife didn't congratulate her for her behavior, so I guess she got upset about it.
All I could really think is that if this is what passes as California leftist behavior these days they're really not that different than the people of Florida. They just act more polite about their behavior.
Long way of saying that you're correct. It's mass delusion, or at least mass willful ignorance so as not to be inconvenienced.
@BE Yeah- I try not to get angry at the minimizers/disinfo ppl, try to remember they're heavily propagandized. But it's hard to endure the mass delusion- when even close friends & colleagues have that attitude as if you're "overreacting" or "anxious" about Covid.
No- just more informed than them about the dangers Covid presents.
Odd how incurious so many are. Odd how they don't even seem to be able to process level of risk of 1 in 10 infection leads to LC & cumulative risk.
@BE It's that- but I'm cautious because I wear a mask Some of the time. Recalling that graph showing that you have to be in the appx top 5% of most careful re airborne exposure to be likely not to get multiple Covid infections.
Some of the time= multiple infections & infecting others
@BE (saying this as other ppl seem to think- realized it read like I only wear masks some of the time).
I always wear a mask/respirator indoors outside of my own small family. Always. Like scuba diving- I wouldn't take mask off underwater, nor take off my respirator in indoor settings either (outside of own home)
@BE I think being inconvenienced is just not acceptable anymore. She was with you until it got uncomfortable and then she told herself it’s all a hoax so she can go about her way.
@BE What all this makes me think of is that we have only one life. And no, my conclusion isn’t that we should shorten it so that we can enjoy coughing at each other freely. What a world! 🤦🏻♀️
@BE I feel you. Basically dealing with the same thing from some family members I would have sworn would be reasonable in 2019. I was wrong
@BE GAAAAAAAAAAAAH. Well, if she or her husband get long covid, I guess you'll have the zero comfort of holding back the biggest I TOLD YOU SO ever.
And if she doesn't, I'm sure the inexplicable heart attacks due to "something else" within a year or two won't convince them either.
WHY ARE PEOPLE SO STUPID
@BE (is it wrong to wish erectile dysfunction on someone?) 😂😂😂
@squeevening @BE No. And I am right now. A co-worker pulled stunt and I am fuming
@BE Fox News owns them now.
@BE I can't read things like this and not think of Dianna "Physics Girl" Cowern who has been all but bedridden the last 18 months due to long COVID (starting two months after her wedding, no less). It's one wrong thing to ignore the risks to oneself; it's an order of magnitude worse to put others at risk in the process. You undoubtedly can't say it, but I will: your wife's "best friend" is evil. My sympathies go out to all the other attendees of that party.
@BE ugh that’s so frustrating and maddening.
@BE This is insane. There is no reason to support friends who are insane, unless you see them as your patients or are otherwise responsible for them. Sometimes we have to say goodbye to those we used to spend time with.
@BE i’ve given up too. just let them suffer. get covid half a dozen times. once enough of them have been permanently disabled, we’ll maybe see some real change, but until then idiots are gonna idiot themselves into sludge
@BE yeah I can relate, so thanks for sharing so we don’t feel crazy for just being too tired to educate the masses. The breaking point for me was talking to a colleague that caught it for the 3rd time and candidly admitted to just not caring if they caught it anymore. They figure they’re good as long as they’re vaccinated and didn’t care that the science on cumulative infections doesn’t say that at all.
All this despite our shared undergrad background in the hard sciences.
At this point, my wife and I have pulled our priorities way back and are just looking out for each other, plus maybe our elderly parents. “Maybe” not because we don’t care but even only focusing on drumming sense into them and no one else is tiring as hell.
Before it comes up, I feel the need to say, too, that this woman and her husband are college educated, west coast liberals. We're not talking the southern Republicans that I live around. We're so far from having the right discussions around COVID and the future.