When I was younger I was very pro-free-speech, then around age 20 or so I became woke. Then I got cancelled and it snapped me out of it. It turned my whole world upside down.
When I was younger I was very pro-free-speech, then around age 20 or so I became woke. Then I got cancelled and it snapped me out of it.
There’s no guarantee of free-speech in the US except from our government. (even that has restrictions) You aren’t guaranteed free speech on internet platforms, nor are you shielded from the effects of what you have said. Was there a certain statement that got you cancelled or was it a number of things?
@nothingplanet Basically I agree with the radical feminist viewpoint that women face unique challenges on the basis of their sex, not gender identity.
@realcaseyrollins @nothingplanet Being a guy in a dress has basically negligible consequences. Women face issues because they're physically weaker than us and because they have wombs (the ability to make babies, which is something we consider a commodity).
Women spend hours putting on makeup and wearing sexualized clothing like high heels because they are positioned as lowly people in society. Makeup is oppressive. Imagine if men wore makeup. Imagine that everyone around you does it, and if you don't you're a freak. You have to literally paint your face, and it takes up to 2 hours every morning. It's no wonder women get paid less, they have to do a great job on top of a rigorous morning routine to make sure they look beautiful.
Would you like to wear makeup every day? I'm guessing not. So why would a man choose to wear makeup every day? This is really just an example, but there are 100 different ways people identify as trans, I don't even know where to begin deconstructing them all.
@mewmew @realcaseyrollins Just discovered this site that compares the performance between teenage boys and adult women athletes, and the results are mostly binary http://boysvswomen.com
@mewmew @realcaseyrollins @alex What's unfair about it? Honest question.
@mewmew @realcaseyrollins @alex in terms of strength and athletic prowess men are just better. There are obviously women stronger and faster than most men, but there is a clear difference in averages, and the best women just can't compete with the best men. That's why you can look at records for teenage males and still be ahead of the adult females.
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Thats only partly true, it depends on the sport. There are some sports where women consistently out perform men, others where the reverse is true. Can't whitewash the reality and the nuance.
Open-water long distance swimming and archery are the two I know of off hand where women dominate and have held world records that exceeded men in recent history (and in fact in both those categories women hold more records than men last I looked it up)
I never said it did. There were two claims made, one about "athletic prowess" and another about "strength". While this clearly disproves the first as to the second its more technical. There are different types of strength. If we are talking power lifting then yes, men are superior. But the point is if we are talking about strength in terms of endurance (long distance) then women are superior, at least with certain sports, like swimming.
So no it isnt really accurate to say men are "stronger" since stronger really isnt a one dimensional property. I'd say it is more accurate to claim men can life more, women can hold weight for longer periods. Roughly speaking.
I'm not sure if thats a useful or answerable question.. I mean what are all the "areas of strength" we are using here. How do you even quantify such a thing.
What other areas of strength are you considering other than endurance and power? Are there any other types?
@freemo @realcaseyrollins @mewmew @alex
Ultra-endurance sports are the one type of sport where women are sometimes competitive.
When you're talking about sports like archery, that's a red herring in the context of a discussion about strength. Archery isn't about strength, it's about hand-eye coordination, muscle memory, practice, technique, etc. So of course women have the opportunity to be competitive there.
You didnt say just strength, you said strength AND atheletic prowess.
What I've shown is two things.. one the "athletic prowess part" is obviously flat out wrong. As for strength women are superior when it comes to endurance-type strength and men are superior when it comes to deadlifting and immediate power delivery.
Neither is overall superior in sports, as I said they have different types of strengths they are each superior in.
@freemo @realcaseyrollins @mewmew @alex If I say "scientists agree that climate change is real", the substance of that claim isn't invalidated by the fact that "only" ~95% of scientists tend to agree with that claim in surveys.
I don't think you've shown that it's "flat-out wrong", I believe what you've shown is that the statement about "athletic prowess" is only true for the vast majority of sports, and you believe because it's not true for *all* sports, you can say it's "flat-out wrong".
Men will dominate in any competition that relies on explosive strength and speed. As the length of the competition increases, the gap between sexes decreases. In a few ultra-endurance events, women can be competitive with men.
Well thats just absurd for one simple reason. The "vast majority of sports" isnt a measure of anything at all. If the list of sports you create are endurance based women win them all, if its power based men win them all. So all your actually saying is we watch/play more sports based on power rather than endurance. Sp its a complete non-point.
@freemo @realcaseyrollins @mewmew @alex
If I said "a Tesla P100D accelerates from 0-60 faster than most cars", would you understand that "cars" probably means the list of production cars that you might see on the road today? Or would you say that statement is "absurd" because you could make a list of dedicated drag cars and throw the Tesla on the list to make it the slowest accelerating car?
I'm not sure how you took this statement and interpreted it to think I was saying that you could come up with any arbitrary list of sports, and that list would always have men at the top in the vast majority of them. At this point it seems like you're just arguing in bad faith.
If it somehow felt that what "sports" meant wasn't clear enough, you could have asked for clarification. And if you want a specific list, we could say "the sports for which medals were given out at the last olympic games" or something along those lines.
Well now that depends on context doesnt.
If you are trying to argue that electric cars are inherently by their nature faster than gas based cars, then yes, I'd say your argument is absurd. Which is basically what your saying.
Your whole point if you go back to your OP was that women are inferior in terms of "athletic prowess" and "strength" a generalization that is not resolved by invoking a list of all sports we happen to watch in the USA. So the argument within context is absurd as it doesnt demonstrate the original assertion.
This is very much akin to what I just stated in regards to cars, if you stated "electric cars are fundamentally faster than gas cars" then we wouldnt look at existing gas cars to prove that claim, we would look at the fastest gas cars and the fastest electric cars, it really doesnt matter what is typically on the road.
@freemo @realcaseyrollins @mewmew @alex
"Your whole point if you go back to your OP was that women are inferior in terms of "athletic prowess" and "strength" a generalization that is not resolved by invoking a list of all sports we happen to watch in the USA. So the argument within context is absurd as it doesn't demonstrate the original assertion."
It was never "all sports we happen to watch in the USA", that you would even put this in here so you can argue against it is a strawman. First it was "sports", and your argument was that since the list of sports wasn't explicitly defined, the argument must have been meant to apply to any arbitrary list of sports you could come up with, which was not a reasonable interpretation.
Men as a group are stronger than women as a group. In competitive sports where the stronger, faster athletes will dominate, men will dominate. Neither of these statements have a significantly different meaning than the original statements that you took issue with in the first place. You are free to nitpick all you want, but the meat of the assertion is true.
No you misunderstood. I am saying exactly that, it was never in the OP "all sports we watch int he USA".. you are now however comparing it specifically to a list of sports people watch, so while that wasnt your original intent thats exactly what you are now doing. You used the term "the vast majority of sports". If you arent refering to the ones we happen to watch int he USA then what is it the majority of exactly? All sports ever played throughout all of history? Obviously it was implied but if the list that is "all sports" is something else other than what I stated by all means, say what you mean.
Your statement isnt false just lacks dull detail. As we already covered the more accurate statement is sports which rely on power men will dominate, sports which rely on endurance women will dominate. That is all, and should be apparent at this point from the examples.
@freemo @realcaseyrollins @mewmew @alex
Women don't dominate endurance sports, they just have the chance to be competitive in some of them. The statement that women will dominate in sports which rely on endurance is wrong. Lance Armstrong was famous for having one ball because it was one ball too few, not one ball too many.
Anyways, now that that's more or less settled, I'd like to address a whopper you dropped rather casually about how the 95% figure I'd mentioned had been "debunked".
However, this is already turning into a hellthread, so...
Incorrect, we find the less a sport relies on power and the more it relies on endurance then the more women dominate it. In the extream case of ultra-endurance sports where power plays virtually no role and it is all about endurance women hold virtually every world record there is and mail fail to be competitive.
One only needs to look at long-distance swimming as a prime example of this. There is no shortage of women swimming the english channel or other seemingly impossible tasks where men are far fewer in numbers and consistently dont come anywhere near the distance women are capable of doing. For example if you look at world records for most number of crossing of the english channel the best record held by a woman is a whopping 43 crossings. Compare that to the same category for men at only 35 crossings. The absolute best male competitor in this purely endurance sport couldnt come anywhere **close** to the women. So yea like i said they arent just competitive in pure endurance sports they cant even compete with women in them.
@freemo @realcaseyrollins @mewmew @alex
"So yea like i said they arent just competitive in pure endurance sports they cant even compete with women in them."
This whole argument is so bad that when you deleted it the first time, I thought it was because you realized how terrible it was. Apparently, I was wrong.
Anways, the reason why your statement is in fact wrong is because there is a wide variety of endurance sports out there, and men still win most of them. In fact, it seems that ultra-endurance swimming is the *only* sport where women consistently outperform men. That you would not even bother to check this before deciding to double down is laughable.
Image 1: World Records for timed runs and distance runs, timed runs from 6 hours to 6 days, and distance runs from 50km to 1000 miles (~1600km), with records tracked separately for men and women. In all categories, men are way ahead.
Here's an article on Women's performance in ultra-endurance swimming. Note that it states repeatedly in the article that this appears to be the *only* sport where women outcompete men (https://www.thecut.com/2016/09/the-obscure-endurance-sport-women-are-quietly-dominating.html).
And here's a quote that explains *why* this appears to be the one sport that women beat men in:
"But according to Knechtle, the probable explanation for women’s apparent competitive edge in open-water endurance swimming is one specific physiological feature: body fat, but for a different reason than the theory about fat-burning and distance running. In the 2014 paper on the Manhattan Island Marathon Swim, for example, he and his colleagues note that female open water ultra-swimmers tend to have a body fat percentage of 30.7 to 31.3 percent; compare that to their male counterparts’ 18.8 to 20.2 percent. “Competitive female swimmers have proportionately more fatty tissue at the lower body than male swimmers,” they note. “The higher percentage of body fat may improve both buoyancy and swimming performance in women.”"
Time of a single crossing is speed, not pure endurance. Endurance would be either greatest distance or longest time doing a thing.
Wow you are getting desperate and its showing. Usually my sign to leave a conversation.
By the way i redrafted it so i could edit in a citation to the actual record set by women in distance that blew men out of the water, men dont come close in the distance record. Funny how you just ignored that and instead decided to start citing other records that arent endurance but speed based...
@freemo @realcaseyrollins @mewmew @alex
"sports which rely on endurance women will dominate"
Yes, and as I explained multiple times endurance is about hw far you can go or who can do a task the longest. Which is exactly in line with what i demonstrated. Any indications of speed, such as you countered with, are not examples of pure endurance.
I also said I was done with the conversation. Please do not tag me again in this thread, thank you.
@realcaseyrollins @mewmew @alex
Untagged. Clearly he doesn't want to get told he's wrong anymore. But briefly, his claim that the "95% of scientists agree that climate change is real" had been "debunked" was also wrong. And it's not just one survey that stat is based on, but many: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surveys_of_scientists%27_views_on_climate_change
Also lets be clear when we get to sports that rely entirely on endurance women dont become competitive with men, they outcompete men, consistently.
Also LOL that you cited a debunked fact in an attempt to make a counter argument. LOL dude doesnt help your case in the least. But I'm not even going to get into that with you, but dont think I didnt notice it, LOL.
@freemo @dave @mewmew @alex Which sports? Ones requiring physical strength and exertion?