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I just bought a level-3 holster. I now have every level from level-3 down covered. If you were to **open** carry what level holster would you use?
For reference the levels are as follow:
level 1: Friction retention only (this is most holsters)
level 2: Friction retention, plus one locking mechnism (A button to release)
level 3: Friction retention, plus two locking mechanisms (usually a guard for the hammer plus a button to release the gun)
@freemo you have to be careful it’s those button releases. A bunch of people have shot themselves because of button releases where if one uses the index finger and maintains pressure after the gun is drawn the finger slides into the trigger guard. For my revolvers I use thumb strap holsters, for autoloaders I use “level 1”
@mandlebro @freemo Yeah, button on the outside releases for retention holsters, ones that prevent simple grabbing of your gun, are such a no-no I’m surprised they even exist (can’t remember now the really infamous model of them).
As I understand it, the good holsters might include a button but that and the real action is inside the holster, such that the manipulations required to release it won’t cause a negligent discharge. These can be so good at their general job the Tsarnaev brothers of Boston Marathon bombing infamy couldn’t figure out how to release the gun from the holster of the police officer they ambushed and killed and left it behind.
@ThatWouldBeTelling @mandlebro
While i agree on the second half, that level-2+ is great to prevent people from snatching your gun, I disagree on your first statement about button on the outside.
2 out of the three level-2+ holsters I have are button on the outside. I have never accidentally hit the trigger hitting it and even if i did the safety would have protected me. So its hard to see a real issue there unless you dont have a safety, in which case I'd say the concern is very valid.
It has to be considered situationally. Im running a 1911, so it has 2 safeties, the palm safety and the switch itself. So a whole lot of mistakes would have to happen all at once to get a misfire.
@freemo @mandlebro Yeah, you and I run M1911s so this is less of a concern unless we manage to swipe off the main safety way too early, which would also likely depress the grip safety.
(Also note I’m 99% IWB well hidden concealed carry so I don’t have good/real opinions on open carry.)
The accidents with button outside holsters were as I recall with Glocks, which in terms of acceptance by US police departments the total lack of a real safety was a big plus, they work rather like the revolvers they were replacing.
Let me mention something from Massad Ayoob’s safety video: guns with external hammers can be safer for holstering. You put your thumb under or over the it and if it releases (SA like M1911) or starts to move up you can in theory avoid a discharge.
Not an option with a normal Glock, and in all cases avoid clothing that might dangle into the holster, windbreaker string closure holders are one known bad example.
With my HK VP9 I would not run a level-3 with front button unlock. The only safety it has is a trigger safety, and that is almost like no safety at all.
@gat @freemo @mandlebro The SERPA holster! Thanks, that was the name I was trying to remember.
This seems to be the FLETC report you’re referring to: https://www.fletc.gov/sites/default/files/imported_files/reference/public-information/freedom-of-information-act-foia/reading-room/training-information/holisterStudy.pdf
@mandlebro Depends on a few factors.
So my level-2 has the button positioned near the waist, so no issue of that regardless.
My level-3 has two buttons, and one of them is positioned like you suggest. However since i always have the safety on that wouldnt be an issue even if it did happen. So far that hasnt been an issue for me even with the safety off.