@wikihow The most broken IMAP implementation ever. Tags are folders, Drafts aren't stored correctly. Google shitty IMAP implementation has been broken for over a decade.

@djsumdog It doesn't get much better than this. Labels as folders is *brilliant*, terrific design choice that allows you to actually use labels in your IMAP clients as well.

@wikihow

@juliank @wikihow No, it's a terrible design because IMAP already has labels! Why not use actual IMAP labels?!

With folders, if you tag something with two labels, your IMAP client literally downloads the messages twice. It treats it as two entirely different messages.

@djsumdog I know the shortcomings, but it's still the best approach for the target audience.

@wikihow

@djsumdog I think this got cut off, but labels as folders is brilliantly easy to discover, most people use them just like folders. It just works.

IMAP keywords meanwhile do not present a consistent workflow between clients, and are too dissimilar in workflow from Gmail in clients where they do exist.

So I agree with the model chosen by Gmail and Fastmail. It's technically nasty but it just works for most users, only a couple nerds go around downloading their emails over IMAP anyway

@wikihow

@juliank
Who cares about the way IMAP presents labels apart from people who download mail over IMAP?

@djsumdog @wikihow

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@juliank Uh... what's the difference between accessing and downloading? You mean clients that literally have no local cache at all?

@djsumdog @wikihow

@robryk talking about a streaming client (w caching) like thunderbird vs a local sync client like imapsync

@djsumdog @wikihow

@juliank
Don't you get some pretty weird behaviour in such clients, given that all the copies of the same message are thought to be different messages by the client (e.g. when you read one of them, others remain unread until you sync)?

@djsumdog @wikihow

@robryk I don't know. I use lieer to sync to local Maildir with notmuch and don't do IMAP anymore.

But maybe? I guess it depends on the client. Notmuch for example dedupes by message-id, so reading one copy reads all of them. So if you sync locally, then import into notmuch you'd get good behaviour again.

@djsumdog @wikihow

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