I'll add that I've routinely given #Google the benefit of the doubt on many issues -- because so many of these matters are indeed complex and multifaceted. But I'm really having problems getting past the ways they've been treating workers lately (not just TVCs, who have always been the lower caste, but FTEs also) and their horrendous decision to permit U.S. election misinformation back on #YouTube.
Yeah the problem with banning misinformation is the tricky issue of who gets to decide what is and isn't misinformation.
We've seen that power abused way too often throughout history and even recent history.
It's better to empower users and the general public than to empower gatekeepers to decide what we get to see.
You're not arguing against me. I entirely agree with your statement. That is not the dispute.
The issue is not whether lies get distributed or accepted. The issue is a step removed from that, who gets to decide what is and is not lies.
I agree that lies get distributed and accepted. You don't have to convince me of that. I'm on your side with that.
@volkris I'd argue that the answer is the same as it has been from the beginning of the press and media, the individual entities decide what's "fit to print" so to speak. So, for example, nobody (at least not me) is saying Google doesn't have a RIGHT to return election disinformation to YT (though they're only doing this for the U.S.!) -- but there will be consequences to doing so that may be enormously damaging to them going forward in the current regulatory and political environment.
If you're saying there will be consequences then that sounds to me like they don't have the right.
If they had such a right then they wouldn't have to be concerned about consequences from regulators, since a right is generally understood as something that regulators can't intrude upon.
If Google has a right to return this information to YT then regulators have no place to regulate that right.
@volkris Well, no pun intended, they have the right right now! In fact, several states have passed laws that would prevent even removing outright racism and hate speech. Other states are moving to require tighter controls in the other direction. A lot revolves around 230. Ultimately those will reach the Supreme Court. Then again, the EU has strict misinformation prohibitions coming into force that will affect Google and other large firms drastically. So it's a changing landscape. But right now, today, Google has the right to do what they did, and likely will for some time, long enough for consequences to affect the 2024 election, for example.
So just based on your own framing , I would not say they have the right, I would say they have permission.
IF, as you say, it's a possibility that regulators might get involved and act against them should they behave in ways that those in power don't like, I wouldn't call that a right, I would call it behavior that is being tolerated for now.
At the moment these platforms seem to have a level of permission to operate so long as they don't let it get out of hand in the eyes of those in power. That's a very different picture from platforms having the right to empower users to speak to each other willy nilly.
If these platforms are operating under threat of regulation, which is the situation you are presenting, then they don't really have the right. They are doing their best to serve us while looking over their shoulders fearful of regulatory hammers coming down on them.
@volkris Don't get too hung up on the specific words rather than the underlying principles. This is Mastodon, not a legal brief!
Yes, yes, this is social media, where we yell at clouds 🙂
But what I'm saying, behind the wording, is that if you are living under the threat of a regulatory hammer being dropped on you if the people in power don't like what you do, then you're not exactly free, you are being threatened only one step removed from the specific threat of jail time or other penalty.
@volkris We are headed in that direction. We are not there yet.
@volkris Again, every study shows that this cannot work. Lies get enormous distribution and are widely accepted. Corrections are buried. Deaths result.