#Matrix subreddit has basically told me that if I want basic features like roles and #emotes I need to learn am entire #programming language and both write and host my own #bot.

This is why no one uses Matrix.


@rogueren I don't know about emotes but doesn't support roles like does. And I don't think roles are such a super useful feature which makes people leave Matrix for Discord. I think what Matrix currently lacks are good and efficient server and client softwares. The protocol is rapidly changing and it's not easy for developers to keep up to date. So we have only one server software which supports every feature and only one client software in the same state.

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@farooqkz Roles don't make people leave Matrix, they make Discord users not want to swap to Matrix. Roles are incredibly useful for community management and having things like certain channels locked to certain roles.

Emotes are a thing on Matrix but not a standard and vary from client to client is they're supported (so far Cinny has had the best implementation)


Yeah that would count. Regarding locking rooms(like channels) to certain roles, I make the rooms private and invite whoever I wish. But Matrix doesn't have guilds like Discord does. Recently however, Spaces has been added with which one can group several rooms into one space(and possibly other spaces, too). But they aren't an alternative to Discord servers/guilds.

@farooqkz Spaces and subspaces can actually be organized exactly like Discord, but most clients suck at organizing spaces and just throw everything into a big ugly list


Spaces in Matrix don't exactly work like Discord guilds. They just group a few Matrix rooms into one.

@farooqkz you can make spaces within spaces, this is how I have mine organized to match the layout of my Discord

So in Discord you'd have the /home/chat topic with all the chat channels, on Matrix you have a /home/chat space within the main space with all the chat channels

@farooqkz this is my Matrix and Discord side-by-side, they can 100% be organized the same. Matrix clients just suck at it.

@farooqkz @rogueren There is not a single client that implements all features. Element is lacking several features from the Matrix specification, especially in the default configuration. :)

@deepbluev7 @farooqkz I think for a Discord alternative, Cinny is the best client. But no mobile version is a big pain point

@rogueren @deepbluev7 @farooqkz

No need to see same icon on desktop and mobile. Can use Cinny on desktop and Element on mobile.
Or some other variation.

@didek @deepbluev7 @farooqkz but Element doesn't have the same organization of Spaces, doesn't have custom emotes, and tends to have a ton of slowdown (at least on Android)

@rogueren @deepbluev7 @farooqkz

Haven't experience the slowdowns πŸ˜….

And even apps that have versions for many systems does not always have same featureset. If Android app does not have custom emotes, just don't use them when on Android.
Really no need for multiplatform there, it's just a difference of icon, as all apps would use the same Matrix client-server API.

@didek @deepbluev7 @farooqkz The idea of the app being different is BAFFLING to most people. Its the reason why when everyone tried Mastodon, the official app was the most popular despite missing features other clients had.

Average people what to use as little mental energy as possible and take the path of least resistance. If they have to figure out what to use on their phone, they'll just say "fuck it" and go back to Discord

@rogueren @deepbluev7 @farooqkz

I am telling them to just use Element.

For you and me, we can understand the difference, so I tell you that you can use Cinny on desktop and other app on mobile of you like it.

@rogueren @deepbluev7 @farooqkz

Like all apps ever created.
Discord lacks some features too.

Maybe it's a matter how you see Matrix.
Try to not see it as a product with flavous, but rather a framework on which anyone can build chat app.

Element/Cinny/Nheko development is just the same process as Discord or Slack.
The difference is when someone create new app, then if they have same feature it's going to work together.

The only software that is "full or nothing" are modern web browsers. And while simple, it created monoculture of Chromium engines.
If we would do the same with Matrix, there would be no SDKs, just forks of Element.

@rogueren @deepbluev7 @farooqkz

I think it's just a matter of perspective, we both agree on how the software looks anyway

@deepbluev7 @rogueren

Oh wow I didn't know. But I think Element is yet the most feature complete client out there.

@farooqkz @rogueren I don't think that is really true or at least it would need more research than guessing. There are clients that have 3 more features and Element has 5 more features than those clients. Since features come in different sizes, it really matters what features you need in the comparison than the raw count. By default Element doesn't have pinned messages, custom emotes, status messages, knocking, tags, stories and a few more things. Many others do have that.

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