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I dont follow Ellen but she is such a sweetie I do love her take on things.
I wish the ban-everyone-liberals of mastodon could learn a thing or two from her amazing maturity here.
https://www.theblaze.com/news/ellen-degeneres-responds-to-online-outrage
@freemo wonder why people hate Bush.. hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
@jasper Lots of good reasons to hate bush, Clinton, Trump, Obama, if they are a politician they probably did at least one thing a morally conscious person would hate.
But how we treat people who have done things we hate says a lot about us not just them.
When a racist true nazi on here goes off on me i am still respectful to them, even if i might not entertain the conversation further and let them know I dont accept what they do.
@freemo she had her on her show too, https://fair.org/home/george-w-bush-now-on-right-side-of-press-corpss-nostalgia-machine/ not like she makes real criticisms. It's propaganda to make Bush seem alright. To make people recall history incorrectly.
It indeed tells a lot about her and that we should not trust her. That we shouldn't watch this shit.
Lots of products in this "market of ideas" need quite a lot of subsidy from capitalists.
@jasper Could be, I mean if she was paid for that purpose it wouldnt surprise me, but thats not the feeling I get.
Are you equally mad at Obama and his wife being friends with Bush for the same reason and call out Obama as being in league with Bush too then?
@freemo you're not going to see much clear quid pro quo, that's not how it works..
Obama doesn't have a regular show, pressuring him has less effect? Also, they're basically openly buddies isn't news, suppose MSM being aligned with the establishment is also largely old news.
Maybe it just hasn't get much attention yet either. It did get attention when he went kitesurfing with Richard Branson for instance. As case of him associating with the wealthy, not caring enough..
@jasper could be their just friends, could be a business relationship, could be both. I'm still not sure i see the problem but id have to watch the episode where he is on and what was said to really judge. If there was no lying or clear deceptions i may not see a problem in that
@freemo omission is lying too. And suspect a lot of people were angry for lots of aspects of Bush, she *choose* the the LGBT aspect, particularly the one the establishment parades the easiest with. And of course then "the right" gets to say the left is about identity politics. (totally not playing into corporate hands)
Well, suppose corporations can't even get that right, for instance, youtube claims to respect LGBT, while they outsource verification of strikes to countries like Saudi Arabia.
@jasper Omission isnt lying, it can sometimes be deceitful and that can be just as bad or worse, but it isnt lying IMO. Especially if we talk government, keeping secrets isnt just not lying, it is a legal requirement (though again not always moral).
Im not sure i understand the relevance of her lgbt focus however. I dont like identity politics but I dont mind someone personally identifying a certain way either. In this case I'm not sure her public LGBT identity is an issue.
I'd be less concerned with the country that is verifying the strikes so much as the policy and standards used when evaluating and how they are upheld. I wouldnt doubt that there is strong bias from youtube there...
@freemo Bush promoted some anti-LGBT policies, apparently. The relevance is that she is saying it as if the only issue with Bush is that. (which is basically the lie)
She also implies the "civility" bullshit. Getting >1M people killed does not call for civility.
You say "could be friends" or "business relationship" like it changes anything. It doesn't. If it were, like her father, or some real emotional attachment or some such, then you could imagine it being a sufficient reason.
@jasper He did, and I dont like his politics for it. I express that with my vote though, not personal hatred towards someone simply for being raised with values i dont agree with.
@freemo yes very smort and definitely not enabling the corporate media to whitewash history.
@jasper I dunno, if i worry about white washing history Obama's used of murder without due process on american citizens and the democrats painting him as a "good guy" is a far bigger offense to me if thats our priority.
I'd take offense if she might have white washed over a DECISION he made as president (just as I do when they do that in the above case with obama). But I have no issue at all with painting him as a decent person who had hard decisions to make and simply made decisions I disagree with.
She is tackling the #1 overwhelming problem in america right now.. the "I'm offended by your difference of opinion" crowd which has effectively degraded america to a shit show on both sides.
So i am more than happy to see her combating the top issue even if that means a little collateral damage to the fact that people dont recognize his mistakes as readily as I'd like.
@freemo people are bad, in my estimation. It is *always* going to because "they made decisions i disagree with". So you're basically saying *nothing* should ever be punished.
@jasper No I'm saying we shouldnt punish things. Those things simply should not be political theory or application.
I will attack Obama being a murderer, I might even push for him to go to jail for it. But I would still treat the person respectfully in my dealings with them. There is a distinct difference.
I also judge a person based on their intention far more than their actions. If someone tries to do what is right and good but i disagree that their choices result in that result, I would not disrespect the person for those choices, but I would attack the decision itself.
@freemo we can do that after Ellen Degeneres fucks off.
@jasper Considering she is leading by example in wrt that suggestion I'd rather her not. But to each their own.
@jasper She never said she questions nothing, only that she can sit and be friends with him. She can and does question many of his policies as she has been vocal about.
I also would have no objection to her sitting next to Obama and doing the same.
If you have issue with a policy, you attack the policy, not the person.
What she did was right and an example for others on how to behave.
@freemo she is part of the problem. "I can sit next to an incredibly shitty ex president, and question nothing." She'd have done it with Obama too.
This "offended" meme is mostly bullshit intending to shut up criticism.
Exaggerating a bit, but if you don't ask the questions in popular media, they might aswel never have been asked.
And everything is a "decision" just like "might be friends, might be business" it's always going to be some thing. What the fuck are you even talking about.