When talking about solutions - if it's more about money or fear then you know it's not really much change or going to feed the wrong things.
I tried to speak to religious people and they always end up saying "But you need money" which has it's truth but put the designed problem first without trying to really solve it. So dealing with reality is one thing but feeding it is another if you don't have sight past the might $ (or whatever dominant currency rules you). If you're not looking past that "money rules" or "money put food on my table" then you know the person's religion is more money or just never risking more towards their God (or perhaps it's one and the same that Man and Money has lead them to God or as God itself etc etc ... could be not trying to claim all reasons / exits).
I want to be sensitive to religious people but bless them, often waaaaay too defensive / submissive / sheepish while everything around gets prostituted / under money (including churches in the end).
Bring back Jesus with the whip I say!
redrafted so comments were going to be deleted and copied and pasted below:
@gabriel said:
" The more you work within the system the more you need money.
The more you work outside of it the less you need it. "
(can revise again anytime without comment too but might be best stuck here as I might revise again!)
Christianity, like socialism, is obsessed with money while claiming to do away with it.
I think people genuinely want to hold on to their lives,
They might see money quite rightly as the ultimatum "money or your life" - so in the passive form of that term it tests one religion and almost make its optional (if you don't agree wit this.. this.. this... this... etc then let yourself die without it and go back to God or whatever next) ...
so some of 'them' (Christians, Christianity or humans) genuinely clutch onto their money at least as short term as it's kind of allowing them to live...
(sometimes it's at a bigger cost to their own religion etc etc)...
...but for some it's to think past it and not excuse only they were born into it and it's better than taking yourself out (though I'm sure we all do think about that and perhaps a sedative or hanging can serious prove yourself to God and the world if you even need to regarding our similar predicaments of 'do money or die / go against the system / ask for a fighting many people )
To alleviate ultimatums which money is excellent at making / designing it's the good work of the people (if I may say so) to not turn our backs on those that have an inkling of imagination past money... and even let those about money fall somewhere more between us...
This means it's probably easier in increments to fall under money than something like inviting more untrained people into our life or even inviting the holiest people literally in (semi-permanently into your home! <--- this is also pretty scary and might get your adrenalin going as you think I'm coming to your house now to get to 'work' under god or whatever...
this is just as one example to divide the burden of money as rent-life has designed us under this and born us into it (thank mum and dad!)... so rather than expect all of us to pay individually some huge euro for rent finding a way to look at each other differently every day because the isolation / 'peace' and quiet doesn't even last long so we might as well invite it in a bit more and get to know each other / make peace with the world.
We have a long way to go and it's not as simple as just money or nothing that's for sure.
Do you mean "I have no problem with people loving money. Money is after all freedom and safety." from your point of view and/or other people's.
For example I do see reasons to see problems with people loving money, but just asking you without actually mixing my opinion there.
Perhaps also say more about "cupiditas radix malorum est" as it's not as plain readable perhaps or clear in the sense you mean it.
Overall the 'too much focus on money' I get from what you say but a reminder that life based solely on money (not based on the soul that is!) makes it *hard for anyone NOT to sell* as the whole system and perspective is to sell your body to the authority or money managers and nobody is an exception / all is made a standard to get you to be a buyer or seller (not sharing etc supported or encouraged or towards free will, only being marketed... if I might ask for your agreement on that?)
I do not believe in free will. It requires belief, which tells you all that you need to know about it.
You seem to be speaking of materialism. Yes, that seems paltry to me, but the ability to be more-than-materialistic (idealist, metaphysical) occurs only when the money is there to take care of basic needs.
But otherwise we agree. Living FOR money ALONE is idiotic; however, focusing on inequality always brings about that end.
I think there can be a balance of minimum to bring it back... like a leaning tree we stop leaning and start leaning back to center...
I think the judgment of "what obsesses you will rule you" is difficult to get out of if your 'obsession' is your life itself and what you are born into it further on from that...
....AND increasingly so per generation! What a dilemma... !
Live or leave people to it... BYE!
As banks and whoever else on the game squeeze even more and simply step up / constrict more this is simply not getting much better here unless.... (well - suggestions welcome for those Christians continually working on 'something' nearer to what God would approve or imagining towards something more different to mainstream funded)
It's obviously mainstream job specifications are not going to support any of this stuff as they are not God-inclined or anywhere near without money being the point of it all, and they are even opposite any God so that's worse there). I'm asking for advice for this part more than debate
What is good idea or what is even possible, even in theory let alone even the courage to do it / try it... ?
Not using the material means really radicalising anyone's life
(which I think all reading this should do... and I can support) but seems in the end it mean accepting this is the life developed or leaned towards by those before us which have good too far and isn't good and probably involves giving up the body / allowing the body risk in order to really opt-out / go for something 'higher' / further than that which the body offers),
How do we go somewhere upwards somewhat if we are to keep the body and it's needs?
I am a parallelist, which means I recognize the body and the need for power, wealth, energy, status, and health.
However, in parallel to that, we also need to seek meaning, which can include the metaphysical.
I guess I am thinking Maslow's hierarchy, but in parallel.
People need food, shelter, safety, and reproduction... but they also need a sense of purpose to life.
That can be materialistic in the sense of physical world only, but it has to also be idealistic, reaching for transcendental goods like beauty, truth, excellence, goodness, and harmony.
When that is achieved, then the metaphysical starts to make sense...
@freeschool @gabriel
I have no problem with people loving money. Money is after all freedom and safety.
However, I think people who state that "cupiditas radix malorum est" should then free themselves from the same.
In the big picture, it's a hermetic principle... what obsesses you will rule you. Too much focus on money makes both socialists and Christians into shopkeeper/slave drivers.