kaniini went back to using twitter LOL

@igel lol he quit because alex uses pleroma code
mate you make freeze software that's what you sign up for

@lanodan @dym @igel @tuxcrafting >On the other hand fedi has much better data control.

you mean the lack of one?

@hj @dym @igel @tuxcrafting I don't mean flow control, we don't have much of this, more like sovereignty.

Twitter/Facebook/…: Send data to us, we'll do whatever we want with it. Also fuck your opinions.
Fediverse: You can host you data and connections, but currently most of the stuff is public.

@lanodan @dym @igel @tuxcrafting legally speaking, in theory it's probably better to trust corporations than tons of mutually-independent individuals with data. Corporations have more at stake with potentially violating the law and somewhat easier to sue. With individuals, well, first you have to find them, then they might not be able to pay compensation for you (and instead do mandatory minimally-paid work), they are also harder to be brought into court and good luck with international justice with that too, multiply it by number of people on the network who you think misused your data.

In reality however, corporations always find loopholes and loose definitions to sell your data or do whatever while being de-jure all fine and legal (i.e. lootboxes aren't gambling, it's "surprize mechanic" etc, agree to us valuing your privacy or gtfo). Corporations also usually have deep enough pockets to violate the law a bit, pay fines and keep on doing it or, again, shape the law.

I'm just saying is, from John Doe's perspective, it's easier to sue Twitter Inc. in case of anything going wrong and that Twitter has more at stake to prevent anything going wrong in the first place, compared to Viktor Petrovich Anonymousov from Zazhopinsk City, hoster of leakyourdata dot su the moonstoroma instance

@hj @dym @igel @tuxcrafting Sure.

Also shape the law? I know few legal cases where large corps completely worked around a court judgement to their advantage.
We basically know by anti-jurisprudence that Google does whatever they want.

@lanodan @dym @igel @tuxcrafting and so does microsoft. You can at least try. Bad actors on fedi are even more unpunishable.

@hj @dym @igel @tuxcrafting You basically don't need to punish folks on fedi.

And otherwise it's just like what you have with people blogging on independent platforms or just using the press.
Sure, sueing for diffamation isn't going to be easy but same shit for other platforms. (also thanks brain for reminding me of France wanting to require an ID to get on social media…)

@lanodan @dym @igel @tuxcrafting what about suing for reading private messages, violating GDPR (i.e. not honoring delete requests)?

@hj @dym @igel @tuxcrafting quarantine the instance, that doesn't sends them private messages anymore.

And for GDPR-compliance… what a mess this law is, it's like "OpenPGP is the best thing we have".

@lanodan @dym @igel @tuxcrafting it's not even mitigation. Let's say important top-secret information leaked online and you have strong reasons it's rival instance's admin that has been reading your private messages and also silently ignoring delete requests. You have the evidence, leak caused you profit loss/property damage/moral damage. You already implemented quarantine but you want repayment for the damages, or at least most people would want that. And how easy it is for this situation to arise it's no wonder that nobody would want to use network for private communications. So, enjoy bringing Viktor Hackovic to court of law from russia while he sets up a new instance under name of Liam Hacksson from sweden and leaks more data from you.

To contrast - Twitter would have little reason to do something like this, but one of their employees might do something out of their own personal reasons and abuse the power (i know that somebody somewhere do that out of abnormally strong sense of justice, no joke). You CAN sue twitter in this case, and you most likely will be compensated, and the perpetrator will be prosecuted to the full extent of the jam probably fired or fined or something.

@hj @dym @igel @tuxcrafting Well sure, you can sue twitter for the compensation, at least if they feel like it.
But it'll change nothing to who actually did it and twitter's network will likely end up with more and more robocops and other pro-active shit so that it never happens with also the side-effect that the network goes unusable.

(Youtube probably had a ban on speech about some french presidents because of leaks from like Sarkozy being publicly drunk thanks to Poutine)

@lanodan @dym @igel @tuxcrafting >But it'll change nothing to who actually did it

it depends. I don't know about google/twitter/facebook but companies that i worked for who has access to client/user data are usually very stingy with access to it for everybody in the company. To the point where accessing data might require internal ID and reason for doing so, among other things to make investigation easier on who accessed what and when. Apart from law there's also "business ethics" which basically affects how other companies treat you, but to me it sounds more like a guideline or a suggestion than a "codex".

@hj @dym @igel @tuxcrafting How is that relevant to "Some random joe using the platform leaked my private info" ?

@lanodan @dym @igel @tuxcrafting some random joe who work for twitter, some random joe who runs an instance

@hj @dym @igel @tuxcrafting And for the random joe which doesn't work for twitter or a known company?