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@adamw Definitely is part of Python: https://peps.python.org/pep-0453/
@pganssle "To support that end, this PEP proposes the inclusion of an ensurepip bootstrapping module in Python 3.4, as well as automatic invocation of that module from pyvenv ... This PEP does not propose making pip (or any dependencies) directly available as part of the standard library." (emphasis original). ensurepip is part of python3-libs on Fedora, which python3 depends on.
@pganssle system pip makes some amount of sense for --user maybe (but why not venv for libs or pipx for apps?) but if you're not using that then you're dealing with packages that are externally managed by dnf so is there really a point? IMO, the more important thing is whether it ships venv/ensurepip or not. Debian/Ubuntu cripples Python like that and that's a bit too much. Not having system Python also makes using `pip` instead of `python -m pip` safer since you can't accidentally run it using system pip then.
@JakubKuczys In this situation I am fine with using system pip because it's a docker container, the whole system is basically one big virtual environment.
@pganssle that's alright but you can just install the pip package then since you do need it. It's just that generally, it doesn't seem to me like it should really be a part of the base package.
@pganssle pip is not part of python. There is no reason it should be bundled together in the core python package.