@JonKramer We have already had two good discussions about the nudity issue... one she will be adding it later, but we had a quick back and forth... I think the best comrpomise there will be to allow top nudity but no genitals or sexual ones (like anal).

@freemo I understand. I am concerned, on a STEM server, can you discuss medical issues and provide pictures of genitalia?

Reading these attempts to define pornography over the last decades, I am trying to present the idea that simplification is the answer. No victim, no crime is my attempt to do this, and offered up for consideration only.

At the same time, I don't wish to see any site I am on flooded by images that drive others away, or become the noise that hides value from users.

But, rest assured, I appreciate your efforts, and the efforts of the others I just read, no matter what the eventual outcome will be.

@JonKramer Well if the rule is that it needs to be marked sensative, or behind CW (which is what i propose).. then yes you can still share it, it will just be obscured until someone clicks to view it.

@freemo @JonKramer

political opinions drive people mad, all political opinions should be marked as sensitive

@freemo @JonKramer

Americans are obsessed with nudity

very strange for Finns who do sauna without any problem (you take off your clothes for sauna)

@otso

I know where I'm going on vacation!

@JonKramer

@freemo @otso , The mosquitoes are the size of birds, and have been known to carry off small children.

@JonKramer

Not inside the sauna their not :)

@otso

@freemo @JonKramer

for diving you have to make a hole in the ice first, that's not needed in the Maldives

@otso @freemo I have been to the Caribbean, and Finland. I will say, going from the sauna that is just to hot to breathe in anymore, running across the snow and into the icy water.... It's kinda like a full body orgasm.

@JonKramer @freemo

this is my exile account, I will get the other one back soon

here I am observing things from Mastodon perspective

thus far it works but I couldn't find some people I follow from the other account

#SelfHosting

@otso @freemo , I think you have stated the root cause of WHY Americans are obsessed with nudity. the Europeans why took over what became the USA were religious zealots. Not exactly the best Europe had to offer.

@pwinn The advantage of the UFI, as you point out, is a more positive approach.. The idea is that anyone int he UFI is sort of "certified" to be a good-actor, at least, so far as the ethics of the UFI go..

So it has two advantages..

1) is it lets other instances outside of the UFI know i follow a certain minimal code of conduct

2) to add a zone of protection against people threatening to fediblock people if they dont block all the same people they do... by promising always to federate with other UFI members this makes them more immune to defederation so long as they remain a good actor.

@freemo ...which is appealing to people who suspect they might be soon on the chopping block, but nobody ever does! Or rather, those who expect to be defederated generally deserve to be, and the zone of protection would do them no good.

You feel strongly the need for a zone of protection because you are in the middle of being unjustly targeted. Most admins are not.

So if I'm running a server, decentpeople.socialbutintroverted, or whatever, and I see there's a proposal, right now it seems like it amounts to: If you're just starting out, or suddenly dealing with a big influx of users, and would like some guidance or advice on moderation, here's a minimal code of conduct that you can use. As a bonus, if you affirm that code of conduct, you'll be able to advertise on your About page that you are part of the United Federation of Instances, which lets people coming to your server know you're not a haven for nazis or pesos or whatever. And if there's any accusation against your server, other UFI servers will stand with you--so long as you're still actually following that code of conduct.

Does that seem like a fair description? Because I'm not entirely sure how appealing that is as I wrote it, but then, I don't run a server.

@freemo I guess what I'm getting at is: in terms of outreach, I hope there's something more. A UFI site to point people that makes onboarding much easier than it currently is, for example.

Right now the choices are joinmastodon, which was weirdly limited and unhelpful even before they cravenly booted qoto, or something overwhelming and unhelpful like instances.social or fediverse.observer.

Perhaps UFI could deliver a better index site? That could be an attractor, at least for admins open to more users, and the "safelist" (I hate the terms "whitelist" and "blacklist") would then be a bonus.

@pwinn Its fair except for one very important fact... that all the accuasations against a server are heard and evidence documented, and democratically decided.

the point is the due process means there is a public ledger of all accusations made against the server and the evidence. and the decision... this level of transparency adds a vital level of protection

@freemo Yes, that is an important point! But again, at the risk of belaboring this, that's on the "exit" side of things, and I'm not seeing much on the "enter" side of things.

It's nice to know I can't easily be kicked out of club UFI, but that doesn't answer why I'd want to be in club UFI in the first place.

Put another way (and now I really am starting to think this horse is dead), people have been falsely accusing qoto, and therefore you, for a while now. But Eugen removing qoto from joinmastodon pushed your buttons big-time. It incensed you in a way that being on a blocklist or three did not. Why? Because it was Eugen, and you care about his opinion more than others? Or, as I recall you stating, because being removed from joinmastodon cut off a supply of users unexpectedly?

I guess I'm thinking it's mostly the latter, which is why I'm saying that I think the UFI needs to deliver some value like that. Be a better joinmastodon, not subject to arbitrary whims, but with a covenant and process.

@wooliex You can see a live preview of the PDF here: https://ufoi.gitlab.io/constitution/united_federation_of_instances_proposal.pdf

Any edits made will show up in pdf right after their made, so the link to the pdf is always up to date... makes it very easy to read.

You can also compile it locally with one command and nothing needs to be installed (other than docker).

@freemo as a small business owner I’m not too keen on the idea that my business account could only post as unlisted.

@wooliex By all means leave your feedback on the gitlab in that recard. I'd support a change to the current document that removes the rule regarding commercial content.