@bhaugen I think "systemic" is important in this reply... So I'd ask "what you mean?" to help define it and help explore it a bit because it's a bit ambiguous while generally people might agree and even people say it all the time.
Questions is open to others also.
Thanks.

@freeschool
> I think "systemic" is important in this reply... So I'd ask "what you mean?"

Capitalism is a class system where one class has capital in the form of money by which they pay most other people to work for them, which brings them profits (more money), while most other people have no way to get their needs met without money, which is why they work for the capitalists.

Non-capitalist would be no private profits (at least). That's a much longer conversation, though. Want more?

@bhaugen Organizing is somewhat easy compared to what I think is important but over-looked: the disruption by others who wish to undo it.
Designs need to factor in other people's actions who are against our designs.
This is what needs equal thought in the actual design itself!
This makes sure it's not just a one-time protest or statement, and more of a live / less static continual way of living and taking up of positions which change and need rolling.

In other words:
It's not because good ideas we're not good enough that that didn't get implemented.
(There were also other forces / weights waiting to be triggered and people almost asked for it by doing so).
And in this way "Failing to plan is planning to fail"

Without planning the "what to do after that happens" and even "stepping it up", then the chess pieces stay quite static / demotivate / get lost without actually reaching another objective or continuing movement... (either in the mind or outside of it).

Permit me to expand on it and practice a bit of writing. I'm still reading what you wrote so consider this ignorant about that for a bit until I read it.

-----
Above was the short version

Below in more detail / optional
-----

So after a while of repetition (protests / inventions that broke the back of hard work or helped feed the world like fertilizers / cures / power to relieve suffering ) you have to realise what you're constantly seeing in the world.
And if we are not factored in that properly then what is it.... hope... even throw away hope since we no they are or want to adopt solving suffering?

The 'do good' people naively don't put that into the equation or expect somehow for them to turn around 180. We seriously have to do it ourselves... 1 + 1 +1 +1 until we get there...
If we prepare next moves or don't expect bullies then the chain of building breaks this incremental approach (and they close the gap / loophole we found, and in legal terms this is what lawyers found when their own system fails them / always wasn't interested in changing themselves)

I think people might even say they expect it but just accept end of game and that's it. This is a bad end to effort.

So innocently or not I'm giving credit where it's do to other side.

There is active action against things once it's significant enough (if it's not a threat to change then design whatever you want I think they don't mind and even will use it).

In the case you make a perfect system, or clear alternative, then the more hi-jacked it's going to get, re-branded, raided, or just unproductive attention etc,

This is all somewhat proportionate and happens "all of a sudden" unless expected.
People will also use what you do to over-do it as their own solution making you look like the bad one. So expect that too!

Theoretically Good and Bd can happen, but perhaps we know consistently bad is the more pre-loaded as default start with control mechanisms embedded and attached to $urvival according to the non-paradise makers.
The non-understanding of others, constant leverage and confusing of other people... (many things) has convinced me.

I don't want to squash every idea but this thinking of the 'other elements' is really ranking it's priority and respecting much higher than the usual person who might not even consider it as boundary or limitation!
Oh yeah let's just do this and make a big company etc etc...
Shut downs, buy-outs, everything there for good story which is actually reality.

A lot of times, even if something works will be a short-lived if it's not cloaked a bit / not on show permanently. Nobody likes opposition in their face... do you?

You may even might find the 'perfect thing' tomorrow and think you should shout it out loud ...not seeing that more bad is going to accumulate as a result so it's tough to not let things free but with more chance for the bad well the road need planning a bit more.
Sad or not, it needs respecting.

The best good is more towards a complete overhaul if the mind as we do super small things.

Merging family or species so it's not just "taking care of my family" as my family is this general everyone here family or at least starting circle.

Actually if not really careful and literally not thinking of everything like that then things can get resprayed and under someone else's colours/banner as a kind of bad-resell or rebranding into product (if not for profit it will dismantled the next day) or labelled something bad by the bad system or a 100 of ways of dealing with any problem. They literally have a handbook (I think) and we should also need to print it and reverse it somehow!

So if we are oblivious to this side (without me sounding like I'm stunting imagination or good-natured thoughts) then this side of equation which involves fighting off those tactics and somewhat ruthless bastards (finance culture / 1's & 0's perspectives / etc) so they don't overwhelm us and again be short lived.

So it's naive for many good people to think it's only about collaboration, instead of the combat sports arena that they are currently inside.

You know about the profit 'system' I think, but for my own writing here I'll add the control rope is mostly survival based ties or security while roping in more and more people into more of these soft aggressive ways which is overall terrible (it leverages living life against itself rather than killing life against what it doesn't like as soldiers one did).

Also nobody likes to say it or admit it or it's hard even to fight about it, but that is somewhat inevitability in needing to do all those things. Near-0 experience is what people might have currently. So just a bit of verbal training helps.

Just right now we are easy pickings in that way and also not being able to even call the colour of money or power-orientated people what they are - this is also a problem if too polite and if you forget or too comfortable.
(yes people follow but they actually don't believe or realise the other abilities they have, measurably again with a bit of introduction and reciprocation).

We seem to need more thorny edges while still being able to softly give fruit to the right people picking (those ecologically minded / non-violent but also not just yes-men or only money-orientated etc)...

Overview / Summary of If's

- If we were allowed to let things grow even a bit longer then it would have already found it's way to grow and solve itself, the same way the opposite has grown and snowballed now but using more diverse and accepting positions.

Obviously like many man-made things there is a reason it went this way consistently as well as in some random order consistently- force was applied, and then on top it's resulted in why everything is concreted and steamrollered. "Sorry but it's just my job to kill / sterilize"

Almost as genuine as we are, the opposite way is also, they want to make things 0 in chance / not growing back / sterile 'clean' / weeds / grass eliminated / full control / less random). And that has to respected somewhat. It's got people hooked, eyes wide-open in some cases too.
It's not just ignorant I-don't-have-time-to-understand-life parents but people who go "all-in" (poker style gambling) and want to win big.
The common "but you have to" type phrases and others seem to quickly come out of people's mouth to make people pay more or charge other people even if they don't have to almost like a social gesture"

- If you found the holy grail system tomorrow then you would get the according focus the very next day, same some inventors have got before which is why I'd recommend not releasing it. And factoring that in before is wise as you have control- once it's out you don't.

SO WHAT SHOULD I DO?
As a quick answer or ideal (and not knowing the context of any reader) the answer must involve the fixing / improving of *mentality* from our own competition mindset to one of collaboration... with and without trying to change any unfriendly 'bastards' because they really know what they are doing. It's a chosen profession and feeds them, you would also be actively attracting their attention when trying to find more good people more silently should be the way.

My equation today means if it's not a threat to the system then it will continue, if it is risking change it will get A-Z of focus and one will break it (unless you have A-Z counters + will-power knowing odds more stack against and even reveling in that).

More precisely than some of the above the system = 'systematic pattern for growing people and their mentality' (or something like that) and that is what we need to work on. Probably mind first at then at same time working on land and ways of defence / hardening will if we accept there isn't much else as a way or it's according worth it. (for example if we think one day they or others will do it for us we could relax and not do much rest assured they might get bored and stop copying / infesting their ways).

So what I'm saying is instead of thinking *almost only* about 'good design' or perfect diagrams (which I'm loving to see), instead of the new efficient code or anything now in tech (that mostly they release)...
the main work is "how to do all these things while being attacked in a.b.c.... x,y,z way" without also telling them and sending advance text about it.

Happy to revise some of this / it might be revised...

@freeschool
Thinking about this, and will return to it after a guest leaves tomorrow.

Short inadequate response is that's why bootstrapping. Start small and local and work out the kinks, because the first "design" will not work. First opposition might come early, providing practice in dealing with it.

@freeschool More response, still inadequate: lots of organizational problems are generated internally, by members. Did you ever read https://pdfcoffee.com/20-enemy-forces-booklet-pdf-free.html ?

But I know external enemies will arise as well and don't have a general answer for them. What have you done in those situations in the past?