volkris @volkris@qoto.org
I think the most pressing and fundamental problem of the day is that people lack a practically effective means of sorting out questions of fact in the larger world. We can hardly begin to discuss ways of addressing reality if we can't agree what reality even is, after all.
The institutions that have served this role in the past have dropped the ball, so the next best solution is talking to each other, particularly to those who disagree, to sort out conflicting claims.
Unfortunately, far too many actively oppose this, leaving all opposing claims untested. It's very regressive.
So that's my hobby, striving to understanding the arguments of all sides at least because it's interesting to see how mythologies are formed but also because maybe through that process we can all have our beliefs tested.
But if nothing else, social media platforms like this are chances to vent frustrations that on so many issues both sides are obviously wrong ;)
Joined Dec 2022
@kandersonus but that knife cuts both ways.
Jeffries voted with the Republican extremists to shut down the House and put us in this position, setting the stage for Jordan's potential election.
He should be held accountable for that choice, not rewarded with even more power.
Right, so what's the difference between the process of selecting Majority Leader vs Speaker? Democrats.
You said the GOP can't elect a leader for their own party, but they did.
The issue here is that the whole House, not just the GOP, hasn't been able to elect a leader.
That's the responsibility of both parties.
There is one difference between the parties at this point, though: Democrats actively voted to shut the House down to put us in this position while Republicans voted overwhelmingly against it.
It's worth calling those representatives out on their votes.
@TwShiloh but we don't have to guess, we can look at the voting rolls and see that hundreds of GOP representatives voted against the MAGA members.
Political reality is that Democrats control the narrative here, so they don't feel any pressure to negotiate.
I mean just look around social media at the number of people who say Republicans shut down the House.
Democrats don't feel any pressure because they correctly know the American public doesn't really understand what's going on in the parliamentary procedure.
Heck, How many Americans can even name the majority leader? Americans just aren't very aware of the details of how the government works.
Oh the GOP absolutely did elect the leader for their own party. Steve Scalise was elected majority leader.
The Speaker of the House isn't the leader of a party, though, the office is the leader of the entire chamber, and so far Democrats have been voting with the GOP outliers to prevent the election of a Speaker.
We absolutely can blame them for that because it is the active choice that they are making for whatever strategic reason they see fit.
Republicans voted overwhelmingly against these people.
Had Democrats not voted to give them voice, they would be marginalized and powerless.
So I really think that we need to see how each of our representatives voted in these roles to hold them accountable for supporting the nuts.
I mean, I don't have any pictures of Nazis for you if that's what you're looking for.
You can say whatever you want! Yay! Social media!
But yes, when Kinzinger failed to represent his constituents he was turning his back on democracy.
And it's worth calling him out on that, and holding him accountable for it.
@TwShiloh again, that's not a practical option because Democrats would refuse to negotiate.
I see zero chance that Democrats would allow Republicans to hold committee power in exchange for a Democrat speaker.
So long as Democrats wouldn't make that deal, Republicans wouldn't go that direction, and so it's just a non-starter.
Remember, the House is not controlled by just a Speaker, but under the rules of the House there's a whole set of offices that matter a whole lot.
So given those realities, moderates don't have the numbers to pick a moderate candidate. So long as Democrats are effectively blocking a moderate candidate, they're stuck with this.
I think it's important to support democracy, because I am again pro democracy, by calling people out when they do that.
If a representative wants to support democracy, they should. When a representative turns their back on democracy, well that's worth criticizing.
Who's spewing anti-democratic verbiage? Not me.
And apparently if you are reading anti-democratic messages into what I write, then I guess I'm not so transparent, as you are failing to see my position.
And also, just to point it out, judging positions based on identity is a pretty basic bit of fallacy, even if you aren't fighting straw men.
Here, for example. A vote of 208 to 11 is a pretty decisive rejection of the extremists in my book.
@TwShiloh sure, but that's a pretty tall order when the entire Democratic voting block is supporting the stranglehold.
Republicans voted overwhelmingly to marginalize the MAGA faction, but at the moment they just don't have the votes to overcome Democratic backing of the extremists.
Until there's a new election and we can replace some of these politicians, we are stuck with this unfortunate math.
@TwShiloh I don't think Jeffries would agree to the committee assignments that moderate Republicans would require for that vote.
That Jeffries voted to oust McCarthy and close the House shows that he's not particularly interested in working with moderate Republicans.
I imagine his own caucus would refuse to accept that arrangement, as they'd lose power they think they'd deserve.
@TwShiloh so long as 200+ Democrats are voting with the ideologues, the moderates just don't have the numbers to elect another option on their own.
To overcome the Democratic vote, the moderates have to give up their preference, unfortunately.
Well that's not true.
Republicans overwhelmingly opposed the nuts, but Democrats backed them and empowered them, leading to this moment.
Republicans tried to marginalize them, but Democrats propped them up against the overwhelming majority.
@TwShiloh well a huge question here is whether to keep the House closed or open it back up.
It's not so black and white: the moderate position is arguably to vote for Jordan so the US Congress can function.
@itwasntme223 it's not humiliation.
A lot of representatives simply want a better speaker than Jordan.
If anything it's humiliation for Jordan himself, but meh, everyone knows it's a political game and nothing personal.
@carnage4life well it's not that they're wrong since they know the ideas are risky.
When an enterprise fails it proves them right: they said it might fail, and it did.
If a VC never had a failure, that means they were probably passing up investments that they should have agreed to. It would mean they were too conservative in their investing, THAT would mean they were wrong.
I always hate to see when someone in a position like Dean has such misguided opinions, but I think it's especially important to call those out when they're coming from people in positions of power.
Your wishes for my voice to be silenced or noted.
That's how democracy works though. It's all about recognizing people's opinions, even the antisocial ones.
@Nonilex yeah but it was working across the aisle that got us in this position in the first place as the House was shut down with votes from both Republicans and Democrats.
So you know, bipartisan consensus isn't always for the best.
I think the most pressing and fundamental problem of the day is that people lack a practically effective means of sorting out questions of fact in the larger world. We can hardly begin to discuss ways of addressing reality if we can't agree what reality even is, after all.
The institutions that have served this role in the past have dropped the ball, so the next best solution is talking to each other, particularly to those who disagree, to sort out conflicting claims.
Unfortunately, far too many actively oppose this, leaving all opposing claims untested. It's very regressive.
So that's my hobby, striving to understanding the arguments of all sides at least because it's interesting to see how mythologies are formed but also because maybe through that process we can all have our beliefs tested.
But if nothing else, social media platforms like this are chances to vent frustrations that on so many issues both sides are obviously wrong ;)
Joined Dec 2022
volkris's choices:
