volkris @volkris@qoto.org

@kvc Oh I would just like people to recognize that they are taking choice away from voters and promoting an undemocratic perspective.

As long as people recognize that, it works for me.

@lauren Right but it means that since different people are projecting different messages onto Trump's rhetorical vomit, on one hand he's not in control of it, and on the other different people are filling in different messages so there isn't a single coherent position being proposed.

That makes an enormous difference!

@lauren Right but that's one of the big reasons why I would reject all of these notions that Trump is particularly comparable to Hitler.

From issues of rhetoric to understanding of the world in general, Trump is just not that capable.

His third grade reading level, and his inability to vomit out coherent lines of thought, means he's just not nearly somebody managing the same sort of campaign.

@rhizome it's perfectly possible for democratic processes to call for undemocratic laws.

Nothing prevents that.

Again, let's own it.

If we are voting for restrictions on voting, fine. We just need to admit that that is what we are doing.

Maybe we should consider some poll taxes? I would vote against them, but hey democracy means I don't get my way.

@liquor_american @chrisgeidner

@decius meh, It ends up being preaching to the choir.

If you're not already on that side then this analysis isn't going to convince you.

So it turns into bias confirmation at best, which is unfortunate.

@DMTea I mean if I was trolling I would simply call you a fascist and be done with it.

But if you're interested in talking let's talk.

Otherwise I'm just going to assume you're a fascist and walk away.

@axios I don't know what's stunning about the headline.

With a closely divided Congress that seems pretty expected.

@smellsofbikes Hi, running a country is difficult, especially one like the US.

It was never expected to be easy.

And that is exactly why we have things like state control over election processes, because with the diversity of experiences, and values, and situations from the Atlantic to the Pacific we've needed a slightly complicated, slightly difficult system to account for that diversity.

And so we have a country with vertical separations of power so that different communities can be responsive to their unique needs and values.

Yeah, that can get difficult. But it's the system we have.

@liquor_american @chrisgeidner

@KarunaX it's worth emphasizing that your description doesn't match the question actually asked.

@smellsofbikes Hey I'm all for supporting your voting for Swift.

I don't know what state you live in, but I am all for every voter in every state being able to vote for whoever they want to vote for.

@liquor_american @chrisgeidner

@joelle in the US the democratic process elects electors, not the president.

But putting that aside, it has nothing to do with January 6th.

Since Trump lost that election it's not like he was elected to lead a riot against his own election that he lost.

That story just doesn't make sense.

The rioters protested against the institutions that they had lost faith in, which has very little to do with Trump, and that's so important to realize. We really need to restore faith in those institutions.

Anyone who thinks that Trump is the center of this is really missing that the general public has lost so much faith in very important institutions, and that faith really needs to be engaged with and restored.

Trump is not the core for that. He is the empty suit that so many projected their opinions upon, sadly, taking out their frustrations upon.

Unless we understand that we're not going to be able to fix this situation and the sad impacts of the Trump presidency or just going to continue.

@liquor_american @chrisgeidner

@michelemccarthy The problem is, that's what Trump wants you to do. It's his strategy.

In general Trump's messaging is exactly why you ignore him because giving him attention just feeds the troll, has the old internet adage put it, and responding to it just encourages his supporters.

Going on offense against Trump just increases the likelihood of him being elected, or of any Republican being elected.

@joelle agreed!

But it's not black and white.

Even though the US has never been a pure democracy, we might want to respect some democratic processes, we might want to respect the will of the voters sometimes.

And so again, when we are saying we are not going to respect the will of the voters, let's own it.

Okay, fine, we will not allow a foreign dog under the age of 10 to be elected to president. Yeah that seems reasonable.

So it's about being clear that for whatever reason Trump is terrible enough that we are going to tell voters they can't vote for him, we are going to say the democratic process is suspended for him, because he's just that bad.

The point isn't to reject democracy. The point is to say, yeah in this case we are owning up to rejecting democracy.

@liquor_american @chrisgeidner

@DMTea Yeah I could have admitted all of that, if it was true, but it isn't, but you know you assume what you're going to assume.

This is social media after all.

I'm under no particular misbelief that folks posting things like yours are interested in reasonable discussion.

But you know, might as well put it out there just in case.

@liquor_american @chrisgeidner

@Joe_Hill Believe it or not, sometimes judges get things wrong.

So we know that claims about Trump's involvement have been debunked by the record, looking at how what people have said he said didn't quite match with what he actually said, with the actual record from raw recordings.

Who knows what's going on with this judge. Others have resoundingly rejected the claims, so Wallace is not exactly a stellar arbiter of the truth here.

Anyway, all of this attention ends up supporting Trump's re-election bed, and I sure wish we would stop playing into his hands like this.

@DMTea The idea that Trump ever attempted a coup is just plain stupid and based on a complete lack of understanding of how the US government functions.

I mean the attack on the capital was on the wrong branch of government for god's sake.

But just setting that frustration aside, I really don't care who you guys are voting for, but I am going to point out that if you interrupt voting for Trump then you are interrupting democracy, interrupting the democratic process.

I don't care how ignorant you might be about how the US government works, I don't care how ignorant you might be about basic notions of civics, you do what you're going to do, but let's just be abundantly clear:

If you prevent people from voting for Trump then you are preventing voting and you are standing in the way of the democratic process.

Maybe that's for the best. Maybe democracy is stupid. Maybe we should not let people vote for who they want to vote for. That's fine. If that's what you want to believe that's fine.

But own it.

@liquor_american @chrisgeidner

@mjmbca correct.

I see a ton of good conversation happening on that site, so the hyperbole seems not only outstated but just really pretty wrong.

Like claiming it never rains anymore in a rainforest (I'm just picking something off the top of my head) it's not only over statement but it's just really out there to say.

@mjmbca Yeah but even more directly, I can actually go on Twitter and see that there are plenty of people on there chatting about different topics.

If you haven't and you're interested you might want to go see for yourself.

But it's simply not true that such conversations aren't happening there. I can see for myself on a daily basis that they are. As can you.

@00Aaron Well it's not so much that developing countries have little trust in the world bank as a bank, it's that they want it to be a charity, and that makes all the difference.

As the World Bank is supposed to be a bank it's just not handing out cash left and right like so many would prefer.

But it speaks to mission creep. That's just not what the world bank is supposed to be.