volkris @volkris@qoto.org
I think the most pressing and fundamental problem of the day is that people lack a practically effective means of sorting out questions of fact in the larger world. We can hardly begin to discuss ways of addressing reality if we can't agree what reality even is, after all.
The institutions that have served this role in the past have dropped the ball, so the next best solution is talking to each other, particularly to those who disagree, to sort out conflicting claims.
Unfortunately, far too many actively oppose this, leaving all opposing claims untested. It's very regressive.
So that's my hobby, striving to understanding the arguments of all sides at least because it's interesting to see how mythologies are formed but also because maybe through that process we can all have our beliefs tested.
But if nothing else, social media platforms like this are chances to vent frustrations that on so many issues both sides are obviously wrong ;)
Joined Dec 2022
@hacks4pancakes specifically what is being deleted?
Isn't it obvious? If a couple of days of employment confusion leads to such dire consequences then we have much much deeper problems.
Our systems are much more rigorous than that. You think we're going to set up a system that can so collapse if somebody is out sick for a couple of days? No. Obviously that's not how we do things.
And as for source, this is a field I work in. I'm part of the team that makes sure things are not so fragile.
Don't believe the sensationalism. Those stories just don't make sense.
@davidaugust and here you are promoting that perception then.
If we're going to focus so much on perception then it would seem you should be a little more careful promoting stories that degrade the perception that you want to maintain.
But perception aside, this is the kind of story that so often ends up being debunked, but more importantly, it's not really in line with the reporting that's going around. And it's not in line with good practices anyway.
If our system is so fragile that 2 days worth of employment confusion would be so critical then there were major problems in the first place.
Fortunately, things don't tend to be that fragile.
@quinn No, that's not how it works.
There's a whole lot of people running around talking about the sky falling, but they're just promoting misinformation. That's not how any of this works.
Don't believe people who try to sell that kind of sensational story.
@davidaugust meh, That's not really how that works.
The NNSA staff that were fired weren't exactly providing the containment themselves. They were pretty removed from the on-the-ground work that actually keeps us safe and secures the stockpile.
The reporting about this has been sensationalized.
@elizabethjacobs.bsky.social Well it's not so much contempt toward federal workers as it is expressing the contempt that so many in the public have these days toward federal agencies that don't seem to be doing their jobs very effectively.
Remember: Trump is a symptom, not a cause. Broad swaths of the country have lost faith in our institutions, and so they elected the guy to channel their feelings.
Yay democracy.
Indeed! Now you're rewriting my own words, saying that I am making an argument that I'm not making.
You're right that there is no point in this because like I said, I'm not interested in your alternative reality.
The record is before us. If you want to discuss the alternative reality where Trump said something different from what he actually said, and where I argued something different from what I actually argued, have fun with that?
But there's not much point trying to sell this alternative record to me.
Or how about we don't replace his words and just recognize facts instead?
The guy said what he said. We don't need to rewrite his words, we can recognize the facts, recognize the record.
Again, yeah I'm going to miss why in the world you are starting with rewriting the transcript so that it fits whatever you're trying to say. I'm sticking with what he actually said.
If you have to rewrite the record to make your point, If you have to replace his words to make your point, well I'm not interested in talking about your fantasies.
You can reimagine the world all you want, but I'm here in the real world and I'm not actually interested in talking about the fiction that you're obsessed with.
@HamonWry If that's their goal then it's pretty weird that they are promoting tax cuts and healthy lifestyles.
@BikingViking this kind of thing is why journalism has lost so much respect in the country.
Forget what's true, let's imagine this whole other world, let's promote crazy conspiracy theories!
It's amazing how often journalists will have roundtable discussions where they try to figure out why people don't find them credible anymore.
This. This is why people lost faith in journalistic institutions.
@Jennifer meh, I don't really think he is trying to enrich himself because he has plenty, and he could probably be spending his time elsewhere to make more money if he really wanted it.
No I think he's just found a next level opportunity to troll, so he's having a hecking good time getting attention in this position, while it lasts.
Again, You're running into the problem where you can't break through because step one is ignoring what he actually said and substituting something he didn't say, that you're making up.
Winning an argument? No I just have this crazy idea that we should respect fact and not rewrite what happened so that you can make whatever argument you want to make.
You're right though that you're not going to be able to break through when it would require me to ignore the facts in front of us.
And you really don't see how your paraphrasing is not the same thing that he said?
I think does not violate any law means exactly what it says, does not violate any law. It means that in the universe of laws that could be violated, the set of violated laws is empty. He said exactly what he said, does not violate any law.
You're talking about being above the law when his statement specifically says no law violation is involved here. There's no law to be above when he says that he does not violate any law.
You're trying really hard to substitate what he actually said with what you need him to have said so you can make this argument. And that's why the argument isn't really compelling, you're clearly fighting a straw man.
@randahl DOE management has been really screwed up for many years now.
From the article, it's not clear this is really about the administration. It sounds like the existing Department management might have dropped the ball yet again.
It's one of the departments in serious need of reform.
"He who saves his country does not violate any law" are literally not the same words as the ones you started arguing about above.
You talk about arguing in good faith when you are rewriting a quote that we can see right there on the page. Now that's an issue of bad faith argument.
I'm merely saying, let's not rewrite history when we discuss what Trump is saying. That's not a high bar for argument.
Wait, so are we supposed to take him at his word or not, and also by take him at his word, you want us to take him at some other words that you are putting in there, that weren't in the quote, that we are or are not supposed to be taking him at....
You see how your stance is a bit out there?
@karlauerbach My experience tells me that all of these stories of stolen elections-- including the stories promoted by Trump to be sure-- amount to to over the top conspiracy theories without much actual backing.
People actually do vote for these congresspeople, for some reason. I mean, yeah out of ignorance, but that's democracy for you.
Like you point out, Congress has delegated a lot of authority, and it has done that over the course of years and years. It's not like that's something that happened last year through some sort of anomaly or stolen election, no we have been voting for congressmen who have been doing that for generations now. We asked for it. So we got it.
That it's been going on for so long reinforces the idea that no, the elections weren't stolen. The American people really did vote for that shift through their representatives.
And so, no constitutional crisis, just the mechanisms in place to give us what we vote for. This is the system working the way it is supposed to work, even if that means giving the people a really bad situation, because if that's what the people want, well again, yay democracy.
@RegGuy so sure, the sky wasn't falling last time after all, but this time the sky definitely is, believe you me 🙂
No, despite the hysterical and sensational reporting, the sky is not falling. A lot of people just don't understand how the government works or how it has worked, so they lack the context to see that so much breathless reporting and political point scoring is pretty nonsensical.
I think the most pressing and fundamental problem of the day is that people lack a practically effective means of sorting out questions of fact in the larger world. We can hardly begin to discuss ways of addressing reality if we can't agree what reality even is, after all.
The institutions that have served this role in the past have dropped the ball, so the next best solution is talking to each other, particularly to those who disagree, to sort out conflicting claims.
Unfortunately, far too many actively oppose this, leaving all opposing claims untested. It's very regressive.
So that's my hobby, striving to understanding the arguments of all sides at least because it's interesting to see how mythologies are formed but also because maybe through that process we can all have our beliefs tested.
But if nothing else, social media platforms like this are chances to vent frustrations that on so many issues both sides are obviously wrong ;)
Joined Dec 2022
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