@freemo sorry, no bad intentions. Depression as label is created. That people get into troubles is true. That is one subject, but that it is created as label is different subject, and that is for profit only, for psychiatry. Drugs do not help any depression, they may just let person become a walking zombie, but is that help?
@louis @freemo Swedes rely on psychiatry and medication much less than people in the USA.

Sounds awesome, right? What is the secret? Swedish society and physiology is not all that different from the USA after all. How do they manage it?

Maybe Swedish society is a bit less stressful? After all, there's parental leave and vacations on a whole other order of magnitude than in the USA, and there is heavily subsidized medical care and no crime-ridden megacities. Life is just better, and Swedes compete with the Danes on being the happiest people on the planet.

Swedes kill themselves 20% more than US Americans.
@louis @freemo

Swedes kill themselves 20% more than US Americans.



So, what do you make of the comparison, @clacke ? Everyone has dark thoughts and Swedes tend to internalize them? I'm pretty sure the stats would show that US Americans do a better job at killing each other.
@alysonsee @louis @freemo I stand behind my implied statement that Swedes kill themselves more because mental health carries more stigma than in the US, and fewer Swedes seek treatment, whether talk therapy, medication or both, even though both are far more affordable in Sweden.
@clacke @alysonsee @louis @freemo I wish I kept that stigma and didn't reach out for the so-called support in the UK. I went through all this shit, and it didn't address my problems. I came out with more trauma than I went in. The meds, the counselling, the CBT, the charities... all of it. I could have done without it.

I did hear later on too late for me that the drugs only work for a minority of people. They also have the potential for awful side-effects like causing the problems you go into it for. It's all experimentation. I don't think the people giving them to me were even qualified for that position, and it was hard to convince them to get me off it when I realised it was detrimental and gave me what I'd call withdrawal for my brain.

@sim

Its hard for me to respond to that because i wasnt there, we just have your opinion. While i completely believe it is an honest opinion you hold, its still tricky on a few accounts.

For example if i take everything at face value then it sounds like you just had some really shitty doctors. From what I know of UK healthcare that is no surprise your system is horrific and you will have a hard time finding qualified doctors in general.

If that is the case that is not an argument against psychiatry it is only an arguments against unqualified psychiatrists. Which i agree are likely to do more harm than good.

The other side of the coin is that depending on the nature of your mental health its hard to gauge what sort of mental health issues you have and if that prevents you or not from being objective about your own treatment. Not saying this applies to you, I dont know you. But it is common for many with mental illness.

I once helped someone I cared about who as he got older developed Paranoid Schizophrenia rather severely. When untreated he couldn't sleep, believed people were beaming thoughts in his head, telling him to kill himself, i would often find him just crying in his room alone due to all the stress.

Despite this he refused treatment of any kind. He felt everyone was part of some grand conspiracy, doctors, me, everyone, so he naturally refused. Ultimately i told him the only way i would continue to help him is if he was getting treatment, otherwise he had to go back and live with his parents. This was enough for him to seek his treatment and take medication.

The thing is on medication he gave me a huge hug and cried as he told me how much happier he was and how grateful he was to me for forcing it on him in his otherwise incoherent state. Thing is after a few weeks he told me he was stopping the medication as he didnt feel he actually needed, he thought he was healthy again and the meds just "made him tired". So he went off of it and back to his old self in a few days.

The thing is when he isn't on the meds he would say things that sound similar, that it was all horrible and just part of the torture and "mind games" of the conspiracy. Despite the fact that clearly when he was on it and rational he felt it was helpful.

Long story short its hard to know without knowing someones mental health history if that may not apply or not.

@alysonsee @clacke @louis

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While I stand by the point that medication and therapy when done right and with the proper care are overall more beneficial than harmful I did want to share this image just for the lols and to lighten the mood a little.

this is basically how you guys see pharmacists :)

@sim @alysonsee @clacke @louis

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