@KelsonV @kkarhan @eff He's upset that they don't think this ISP is the right bunch to be intervening here.

It involves a particular site, which I think started off as one to harass a particular person.

@olives @KelsonV @eff nah...

People who defend the hategrooming scum of #KiwiFarms are just bad.

Regardless if #EFF, #CloudFlare and whoever else is hosting or providing services to said shitsite.

I'm not going to reiterate shit - look it up yourself...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kiwi_Farms

And then tell me your position...
https://mstdn.social/@kkarhan/110987470524664901

@olives @KelsonV

And yes, @eff doesn't give shits about things worth fighting for...
https://503junk.house/@rose/110985165520274278

@kkarhan @KelsonV @eff I think there is kind of a distinction with a T1 provider, it is a greater bottleneck.

It is frustrating how seemingly ineffectual they can be in fighting for free expression. They're a free speech group, but unless the government is passing a bill, they nap in a lot of cases.

Government authoritarianism is important to oppose (and I suppose you don't want core infra providers with itchy fingers), of course, but so much is of a more corporate nature.

When I say free expression, I don't typically mean Joshua's little site here, it's more basic things like sexual expression, art, and more.

https://protectthestack.org
When they do comment on that (sort of), it is primarily in the context of infra.

@olives @KelsonV @eff you don't get it, do you?

1. #HurricaneElectric isn'a a Tier-1 and even if they were, there is no legal mandate for them to accept anything or provide services to anyone.
Espechally since there's no legally enforceable #NetNeutrality nor are they regulated as a "utility service" with "must provide" clauses.

2. Providers are already very twitchy and they'll block entire ASNs if they get listed by #Spamhaus.

3. #KiwiFarms is indefensible thus invalid discussion.

@olives @KelsonV

4. I'd follow @eff's argument if they also protested against financial embargos with no legal backing by payment processors against anything even remotely considered "sexual".

5. It only applies to KiwiFarms' ASN, so it's not as if there is any collateral damage to it.

6. You can make the argument about censorship by big providers once GMail, YahooMail, Outlook.com/Hotmail/Azure Hosted Exchange/GoDaddy et. al. do process abuse reports and don't just randomly block stuff...

@kkarhan @olives @eff

"I'd follow @eff's argument if they also protested against financial embargos with no legal backing by payment processors against anything even remotely considered "sexual"."

They do.

https://www.eff.org/search/site/mastercard

@kkarhan @olives @eff Anyway, it looks like there are two separate conversations going on here. (I didn't see olive's posts at first- apparently my instance limits qoto)

I'm not defending KiwiFarms, and I don't agree with the EFF in this particular case. If you want to continue that part of the conversation, please leave me out of it.

I'm only disputing the claim that they've ignored left-leaning issues, because it just doesn't track with what I've seen watching them.

@KelsonV @kkarhan @eff Visibility is very complex on the fediverse.