FailForward @FailForward@qoto.org

@thor Your initial description was i’ve just had to carry myself by my bootstraps which points to a greater resiliency. What you write later on indeed indicates that it was (is?) an extremely bumpy ride, so I take back what I said. Anyhow, I recommend the book wholeheartedly. It gives solid understanding of what is going on in lives of many people around and provides a solid scientific conceptual structure around it. And it’s not a hogwash handwaving. The author is not a psychologist and does not dabble in psychology. It is solid medicine, biology/biochemistry and loads and loads of empirical research.

@shibao @evelyn @zleap

@thor Which would still put you squarely in the dandelion part of the spectrum. Orchids typically can’t do it, they are too prone to environmental influences.

@shibao @evelyn @zleap

@piggo @georgia It’s no too difficult to make (if you know our way around yeast dough). In this specific case, the main problem would be the type of flour to use. In CZ/SK it’s normal to use differently milled flour, while in Western EU, you’ll find only fine milled variant, which is not good for this. I figured a way around it for some countries, but nothing beats half-coarse milled flour for knoedel.

@thor

very very very relevant reading: https://www.amazon.com/Orchid-Dandelion-Children-Struggle-Thrive/dp/1101946563/

@shibao @evelyn @zleap

@georgia Boehmerknoedel 😄
@piggo

@thor Well, that is a laudable mission there.
@shibao @evelyn @zleap

@piggo Come on, it’s a good joke!

@thor

What I was hinting at was that when somebody, for whatever reason, does not/can not consider that the solution to their problem has a lot to do with them, they simply are not accessible to advice and help.

At least the psychologists I met and stuff I read clearly says: you cannot help people who do not want to be helped.

That is what meant by “being reflective” - to have at least some doubts about whether help is even possible.

@shibao @evelyn @zleap

@piggo I guess this wasn’t the intention, but it gave the post an entirely different flavour:

@zleap Yeah, that’s right. But then you attract only weirdos who keep going despite feeling that they have no clue and then realize ex-post what it’s all about. No wonder this place is full of technical people and renegades who cannot find a calm place elsewhere 🙂

@piggo

@thor

The diagnosis is clear. But I wonder whether you can significantly prevent that radicalisation easily. It seems to me to have something to do with the ability to reflect. If you are unhappy and deeply convinced it’s due to some external factors (the world is bad!), it’s just a matter of time for you to find the “correct” culprit. If, on the other hand, you are quite self-reflective, you’d be probably suspicious about external factors and would also consider internal ones, which is the path towards self-improvement, studying a bit on psychology, mental health issues, etc.

What I am saying is this: people who ONLY consider external reasons for their internal emotional/mental states seem to be rather oblivious to topics of mental health.

@shibao @evelyn @zleap

@zleap How can you be serious about something you don’t even understand?

For me it was exactly the thrill of meeting something I did not understand at the first sight what made me go on. Maybe that’s the filter: it passes people who are attracted by “weird” and “not-easily comprehensible”. But my initial confusion was real.

@piggo

@zleap @piggo I don’t know and honestly don’t care too much. What I am saying is that Fediverse has a problem with the on-boarding experience.

You effectively get a whole new conceptual world dumped on you. Too much friction.

But then again: it’s a filter too. You get to speak mostly to people who passed the test 🙂 . Not that they are somehow nicer bunch, but at certain level there are some commonalities in personalities, I suppose.

@thor

In that case apologise. And I leave it at that.

@shibao @evelyn

@piggo @zleap Maybe the problem is branding:

1. world: Mastodon is good
2. me: Masto what? Where?
3. me: aha, Mastodon, whatever
4. world: Fediverse!
5. me: Masto vs. Fediverse vs. XYZ?!? WTF!?
6. me: study for 2+ days to grok this sh*t. As a software guy, I tell you 2 days is a lot.

So what do you expect from laymen? No wonder they can’t turn their heads around it.

Perhaps it should go more like this:

1. world: Fediverse!
2. person: Fedi what? Where?
3. person: right, I can be on Fediverse tweets, with blogs, with pics, or videos, whichever I want
4. right…

I.e., instead of Mastodon, Pleroma, Friendica, Peertube, etc. which are all confusing, there should be a single brand plastered over all of them with a single name, single brand, single logo. Something like this - you get the idea I hope.

@piggo @dragnucs I think it’s called Digital Wellbeing app, or something like that

@piggo Haha, I know that one!

@thor

Come on! That’s not what I meant. Write for men - actually I think it’s a brilliant idea and I support it. You are right, there’s not much specifically tailored to male audience in this department.

I just tried to prompt you to slow down on the thought path of “men have it so bad, the world is unjust, etc.” Doesn’t sound like a good start of a useful mental health advice column to me…

Personally, when seeking information on psychology, it never even crossed my mind that it’s gender non-neutral. But perhaps my obliviousness to this can be explained by me focusing on more scientifically leaning literature, rather than popular advice columns.

Having said that, I do indeed see a lot of value in more laymen pop advice on psychology targeting male audience.

@shibao @evelyn

@thor

Very good topic there! Now, I am going to respond to a semi-random response in this thread, so sorry for breaking the structure a bit.

You make several points:

1. most advice on mental health/psychology out there seems to be female oriented;
2. culturally there seem to be issues with addressing men on these topics: both just addressing them might “seem to create a problem” and also they as “audience” would probably be in denial (or are supposed to be in denial?).

I think on both points and also some others you make (Peterson, etc.) you are partly right. But I also think these are distractions. In the first place men are human beings as are women. So whatever advice out there shall be tailored for both. Perhaps I am just lucky to be an environment where also men open up. Yes, it’s true that more women around me go to see a therapist/psychologist than men (as I do), but I also sense plentiful interest from men around me in topics of psychology, mental health, overcoming anxieties, depressions, etc. What I am trying to say is this: yes, some groups of people around are less easily open about these topics, but I personally found that all are about equally sensitive. While I know many sensitive and deeply self-reflective men and women, I also happen to know men and women who are equally oblivious to all this stuff.

My take: forget about genders on this, target human beings with your thoughts on this. And if you decide to illustrate it with photos of men, kudos to you, a good choice there 🙂 .

@shibao @evelyn

@piggo Normally I move in a different corner of YT (music theory, tech, history and such). Now I got wound up on this foodie corner (your fault!), I find it immensely interesting :-). (Obviously I did not stop when I still had a chance - my fault now).