FailForward @FailForward@qoto.org

@wolf480pl Well, our conversation started with the question whether it’s OK for a company to choose where and with whom it does business with. And there indeed it’s anybody’s choice - as far as otherwise legal, morality is not an issue, it’s a freedom of choice. Here we are sliding into a somewhat different territory.

@piggo

On the complexities of content moderation vs. Twitter + antics of Mr. Musk saga:

https://nitter.it/yishan/status/1586955288061452289

I find this thread really interesting and enlightening.

@wolf480pl And yet we agreed not to sell alcohol to under-18s, or weapons to members of societies we don’t like. See, it’s not all black or white. I guess we both agree what is going on and why it is so. Where we perhaps differ is where we stand on the spectrum between the reality vs. where we wish the reality were.

@piggo

@wolf480pl Of course you are right, there are limits to a company’s and individual’s freedom. In the case you cited, it would be unconstitutional in most countries I care about. But it’s more subtle than that.

• freedoms: A company or an individual are free to do business as they see fit as far as it is 1) legal and 2) they are ready to bear consequences of their decisions. Moral or not. It boils down to a simple thing: I am free to chose my friends and business partners. And I also am not obliged to be friendly to everybody. And on top, nobody has a right to tell me who I shall be friends with. You have that right too. And I am sure you exercise it as well.

• society in/out dichotomy In the end, while we agreed as societies that discriminating against our own citizens/fellow society members on the basis of race, religion, etc. is wrong (for good reasons) = non-discrimination against fellow society members; note, nothing stops us (at this point in history) to discriminate against citizens of other societies = discrimination against non-members of our societies. And it is a thing happening every single day: did you notice the last time you flew different queues for “home” passport holders and “alien” passport holders? Or the whole visa, or residency concepts… In other words, discrimination against non-members of a society is at this point in history an accepted thing. And personally, I see the point of it, even if I would wish to live in a society where that were not true.

@piggo

@wolf480pl We are living in a free society. Individuals and companies are free to “apply sanctions” as they see fit, there is nothing wrong about it - as far as they are also wiling and prepared to bear the consequences of those decisions. I am not obliged to do business with people I don’t like, or don’t want to do business with. Is it stupid from somebody’s perspective? Maybe. Silly? Perhaps too, but that is how freedom works. I don’t need to coordinate with my government on that.

Whether I am interested in not alienating ordinary Russians is also besides the point. They do the job better than I ever could (c.f., e.g., https://nitter.it/JuliaDavisNews, or francis_scarr’s feed).

@piggo

@wolf480pl I agree. But either way, it’s on us, the civic society to check on them too - after all, money tends to trump morale, so relying on the govt only is probably naive.

@piggo

@piggo That’s a great shame indeed. For now there is a significant push in the country to “move something” about this, but I wouldn’t have high hopes for it to go anywhere. We’ll see. Ostrich politics at work in this little land of innocent and ignorant.

But let’s not pretend it’s all rosy elsewhere. I recommend reading kamilkazani’s twitter - it is very instructive - the guy is stirring the pot on German, Czech and other military exports to Russia quite a bit (especially Rheinmetal et al). For instance this thread (and related ones from September) are a good start: https://nitter.it/kamilkazani/status/1567882093585203200#m

And his findings lead to news stories later picked up - for instance that Czech stuff ended in October in mainstream press in CZ and the German connection findings too.

@wolf480pl

@piggo you miss him, right?

@pony But that’s a silly comparison, isn’t it? VPS vs. metal, inflation, etc. Anyhow, ca €500/yr for a state of the art server you do not even need to switch on, is quite a good bargain. And if it’s too bad, you can still get the tiny VPS for breadcrumbs money.

@staalmannen Nice intro. A large portion of it I could have written myself :-). Welcome.

@pony Looking at machines I care about, it was just a couple of bucks across the board. When I carefully look at it, it seems it was almost precisely 10% price hike. Given their pricing, I think it’s still a bargain. Do you see some drastic changes in your monthly bills?

@rglueckler welcome @fediscience.org

@shahaan@eldritch.cafe Indeed I greatly miss my red Nokia E63 (I only put it to rest in 2017!).

@bodomenke

There is no concept of “Warmmiete” in NLD as far as I know. When you rent an apartment, you simply arrange your own water/gas/electricity/Internet connections yourself. And when you leave the rented place, you simply stop the contracts (or notify them of a move elsewhere) and the next renter chooses their own providers again. In turn, the energy provider has always a direct relationship to the person/family/entity who lives in the dwelling. Of course there may be some exceptions, but I never heard of them. This is how it works “normally”.

@isotopp

@worldsendless not sure about your model there (SHR240?). Stuff like this puts you at $4.95.