Yet another indication Joe is clueless.. I dont care so much about the pipeline workers, but I do care about the environment. Blocking pipelines means more pollution, and a hell of a lot of it. But Joe is either not smart enough to understand that or cares more about his image than doing good. No surprise.

#USPol #Biden #environment #Oil

@freemo I think you pasted the wrong image. That's not talking about a pipeline. Anyway, are you saying that an oil pipeline does not facilitate burning fossil fuels?

@koherecoWatchdog

The image is Bidens response when asked about how he blocked the pipeline the effect it would have on workers. So yea its about the pipeline.. why what image do you see?"

And yes i am saying that a pipeline does not facilitate burning oils, well not exactly. Oil can get from point A to point B many ways, the three main ways are train, truck, and pipeline. The quantity of oil transported is based on demand, blocking one of these only causes the oil to move by the other and has no effect on the amount of oil in circulation or consumed.

Combine that fact with the fact that of those three ways pipeline contributes by far the least amount of pollution per barrel.

So the effect of blocking the most evo-friendly mode of transport and forcing companies to utilize significantly less eco-friendly modes of travel is not that there is less facilitation of oil, only that there is far far more pollution and little else to gain.

@freemo ah, my bad.. I pasted the wrong URL (I use bitlbee not a GUI). The pipeline reduces the delivery cost, which has the ultimate effect of increasing consumption.

@koherecoWatchdog Not really the effect is marginal..

That would be like arguing we need to push for more coal energy because coal is less economical and costs people more therefore it reduces consumption.

Increasing price by 10 cents and then ensuring the oil you deliver pollutes x3 as much as it would otherwise is no win.

@freemo You have to pay drivers, pay for the fuel itself, pay for the infrastructure (like office workers) to schedule deliveries, etc. So of course there's a substantial cost savings with the pipeline or the profit-driven oil co wouldn't be trying to do the pipeline. The actual pollution from the trucks/trains is marginal.

@freemo it would be ideal to allow the pipeline but then introduce a cost-prohibitive tax on the fuel, but that's impossible to do politically.

@freemo It was tried in California. Sadly, even CA democrats who are generally pro-environment fought fiercely to shut-down the democrat in office who tried to increase the gas tax. Ppl's tune changes as soon as their own lifestyle becomes threatened.

@koherecoWatchdog If you cant implement solutions that reduce oil consumption, real solutions, then better to do nothing.

Blocking pipelines is a huge step backwards and is effectively dumping millions of tons of CO2 into the air with no real benefit other than costing people a few pennies on their gas price which we already know people will easily pay anyway.

@freemo if the fuel cost raises by 10 cents due to market circumstances, car drivers will pay it. But if the cost of fuel increases by 10 cents due to an artificial gas tax, ppl will stop at nothing to send the politician packing and overturn the tax.

@freemo so it's important to embrace scenarios that cause the market price to increase.

@koherecoWatchdog not when those scenarios have a net result of more pollution and not less. Blind ignorance towards a goal without analylizing the results of an action is how we cause more harm than good...

Dice it however you want the simple fact, and what the numbers show, is that if you block pipelines the net result is more pollution, not less. Pipelines contribute negliible pollution, Trains for transporting oil alone (and thats more ecofriendly than trucks) contributes 10 million tons of just CO2 for the transport of oil inside the USA. Trucks produce significantly more than that.

@freemo The figures you're talking about apparently don't account for cost reducing demand. Not that they're sloppy, but how could they? It's guesswork. And as you've said, your working assumption is that a cost increase doesn't decrease consumption. This is why the figures are bad.