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You can tune any instrument to any arbitrary frequency for center-c and as long as all the notes are of the same relative difference between them the melodies will generally work and harmonize. As long as all the instruments are synced it will sound ok in a band too.
In modern day we have a definition of what frequency center C is. But I have to wonder, how do we know the modern day frequency for middle-C is anywhere near the frequency used historically. In fact, when even was the idea solidified at all?
@freemo
You can't tune any instrument for any arbitrary frequency.
That's why the tuning sequence of an orchestra starts with the oboe.
Historic woodwind instruments preserve their pitch and make it available to contemporary precision frequency meters even though measurement instrumentation to determine absolute frequency wasn't available when they were built.
@tatzelbrumm Huh? I dont follow how you got to the consequent from that antecedent.
> How can you determine absolute pitch of musical ensembles from times before precise frequency measurement devices were available?
You cant, thats was the whole point of my post. Today we tune to specific frequencies as a base line. In the past it was arbitrary. How far back in the past determines how arbitrary it is.
Thats the whole point, a song that may have survived a long time may have been intended for a very different pitch than it is in modern times. Unless they had some standard way to get an approximate baseline pitch (such as defining a standard for the size of a tuning fork)
@freemo
There are (wind) instruments whose pitch only depends on physical dimension and speed of sound, cf.
https://www.oboefiles.com/why-does-the-oboe-tune-the-orchestra-and-how-to-do-it-right/
If the physical dimension and speed of sound didn't change since the instruments were build, you can reconstruct absolute pitch from the past.
@tatzelbrumm Right, and such a windinstrument **if** the dimensions are preceisly standardized would be a frequency reference itself. I agree at that point you have a somewhat standardized middle C.
But when did wind instruments become universally standardized in their dimensions? Moreover when did such a standard become closely aligned with a specific musical note.
@freemo @tatzelbrumm of your instrument didn't sound like your peers, you'd tune the odd one out to match. Factor in traveling musicians and it settles to a standard.
Right, id expect there to be local syncing and even somewhat of a natural local standard that would form naturally... The question is more about when did people try to quantify and define those standards against an actual frequency that is some how referenced.
"Scientific pitch was originally proposed in 1713 by French physicist Joseph Sauveur and based on the numerically convenient frequency of 256 Hz for middle C,"
@freemo
How can you determine absolute pitch of musical ensembles from times before precise frequency measurement devices were available?
You examine instruments that cannot really be tuned, but whose pitch is based solely on their geometry and physical constants that don't change over time.