@iankenway Its funny how every time someone wants to break up consolodated power (such as we have with the EU) every prediction is of doom.

Those in power do everything they can to stay in power.

I think anyone who cares would want a deal made, not a no-deal. But tat isnt in the EUs best interest as no-deal keeps the power the UK once had over itself in the EU since it prevents a brexit. Thats in their best interest.

What is far more likely to happen is if the UK leaves under a no-deal scenario the EU will quickly change their tune and any deals of mutual benefit will quickly be made.

These sort of doomsday predictions make absurdist conclusions. In this case the assumption that no post-brexit deals will ever be made, which is non-sense as we know deals with the EU are made all the time with non-member states.



Thank you for your recent comments.

You refer to the EU as a ‘consolidated power’. In a sense this is true, but so too is the USA. (I lived in Nevada for over two-and-half years – now threatened by climate change - the Colarado river, Lake Mead etc.) What matters is the history that led to its creation and provides its fundamental raison d’etre. In the case of the EU, this ultimately is not trade, but the prevention of war in wider Europe which was the cockpit of two devasting conflicts. My grandfather, along with a number of uncles as well as my late wife’s father who was born in British Guiana (as then known) in South America, put their lives on the line to defeat fascism. The latter has never gone away and in recent years has re-emerged from the shadows wearing the mask of ‘populism’ i.e. ‘the will of the people’ etc.

The desire to prevent another world war starting in Europe lies at the heart of the Treaty of Rome and was underwritten by the four freedoms enshrined in it – namely the freedom of movement of goods, services, capital and persons. Me, I believe that the ‘four freedoms’ should be extended globally. To that end, I think that all countries should aim to dismantle border controls and make ‘passports’ a thing of the past. I also believe in free markets rather than ‘command height economies’ (e.g. former USSR), However, most free markets are not fair because they are rigged (cartels and monopolies) and most regulatory bodies are stuffed with industry insiders and, for that reason alone, can never be effective. But there are many other freedoms that need to be enshrined in international law. For example, the right to privacy, the right to cognitive liberty (including ending the so-called ‘War on Drugs’), the right to freedom from poverty (Basic Income to replace means-tested state benefits). I also believe that 14-year-olds should be given the vote. And so on and so forth…

The EU is confronting many problems. It needs to undergo serious reforms. However, at the end of the day, I believe it to be an heir of the Renaissance and the Enlightenment. Compared to the ridiculous shenanigans at Westminster in recent years, it is a beacon of civility and serious forward-thinking. Yes, it makes mistakes. Yes, it is occasionally overbearing. However, its sins are trivial when compared to those of national governments. Paradoxically, Brexit has strengthened rather than weakened its hand. In the Netherlands those in favour of remaining in the EU stands at roughly 72% even though the population is increasingly confused on the subject. Many countries are seeking to join the Union (Bosnia, Moldova, Albania and indeed, still, Turkey). I understand that multi-lateralism is anathema to Trump and Putin, but to be honest, that’s their problem, not mine.

Finally, while I agree that if the UK were to leave the EU without a deal, new trade deals would take place, they would be slow in the making and leave the UK significantly worse off. You don’t need to believe me, you just need to poll any reasonably informed person in the Commonwealth, Japan, Far East Asia or the Antipodes!

Best (me – “just relaxed and paying attention” (or trying to))!


"You refer to the EU as a ‘consolidated power’. In a sense this is true, but so too is the USA."

YEs that is true. I am also very vocal about the consolidated power in the USA government is exactly why we now have rampant corruption and politicians that have the emotional IQ of a toddler. It is exactly the lesson from America (as someone who fled america) that I bring to the EU and exactly the reason why i dont want to see the EU go down the same destructive path as it already has.

I agree that the goal of the EU in its early days was a good one. As someone who moved here to the EU I've tried to discuss and study it as best I can. In its early form and early intention it wasnt so bad. But it has gone far far FAR beyond a trade union or a means of preventing war. Now it is a beast with regulatory and legal restrictions on its member states that should not be acceptable to any voter IMO

I do agree that brexit right now has strengthened support for the EU. The EU manipulated people expertly and while acting dishonestly to keep the UK in they managed to dupe everyone into thinking it was the UK's fault for the poor decision. However I have no doubt that if and when the UK exits once they see all the doomsday BS was false and that in fact the UK thrives outside the EU that that opinion will shift very quickly. All the more reason the EU is desperate to make sure that doesnt happen.

Sign in to participate in the conversation
Qoto Mastodon

QOTO: Question Others to Teach Ourselves. A STEM-oriented instance.

No hate, No censorship. Be kind, be respectful

We federate with all servers: we don't block any servers.