jansegers @jansegers@qoto.org
Webosoof
Joined Oct 2019
Limba străină care poate fi învățată în 30 de ore
21 Dec 2018
Limba străină care poate fi învățată în 30 de ore Foto: pixabay.com
Toki Pona este limbajul cu cele mai puţine cuvinte din lume, conţinând doar 123. Toki Pona a fost creată în 2001 de către Sonja Lang.
Ea şi alţi vorbitori de Toki Pona susţin că numărul redus de cuvinte este de ajuns să exprime aproape orice idee.
Pentru a crea noul limbaj, Lang a lucrat invers, împotriva tendintei generale de a crea un lexicon natural. Ea a început prin reducerea şi consolidarea specificului în general.
Economia acestei limbi se realizează reducând gândirea simbolică la elementele sale de bază, fuzionând concepte conexe, iar cuvintele îndeplinesc mai multe funcţii în vorbire.
O persoană are nevoie doar de 30 de ore pentru a o învăţa Toki Pona. Această uşurinţă de a învăţare, o face ideală pentru a putea fi folosită ca limbă internaţională, care ar putea conecta milioane de oameni de pe tot globul, potrivit businessmagazin.ro.
https://www.antena3.ro/life/limba-straina-care-poate-fi-invatata-in-30-de-ore-500589.html
Conlang Quest
Fourth Language Review: Toki Pona
2013
Toki Pona is based on the ideals of simplicity of thought. This seems fitting as it is immediately apparent that no complex thought went into the development of Toki Pona at all.
Toki Pona is seventh circle of ambiguity hell. I imagine that it’s very easy to learn, since many words can potentially mean lots of different things. Here are a few examples:
suno <- Sun, or Shiny/Something that shines, Day [2][1]
pona <- Good, great, cool, thanks [1]
suno pona <- A greeting that apparently can mean “good day” … it could also mean: “good sun, cool sun, great sun, thanks sun, good shiny something, cool shiny something, great shiny something, thanks shiny something”
GAH!
The grammar, as per usual, also doesn’t protect against syntactical ambiguity (much like Esperanto, Ido, or any other constructed language that I’ve reviewed thus far).
All in all I do like one aspect of the language… honesty
A classic example of this can be seen when translating to plain English the doublespeak that large organizations use to manipulate and dehumanize people:
“downsizing” mass firing of employees
“collateral damage” killing of civilians
“pre-emptive war” invasion of a foreign country
http://en.tokipona.org/wiki/What_is_Toki_Pona%3F
Summary
I find that Toki Pona would be an incredibly easy to learn language for very simple communication. It does not provide many, if any, scientific or industry terms. It’s limited, easy and as a result: ambiguous. If you’re looking for a more complete and more widely spoken language that’s also easy to learn, again, I suggest Ido.
[2] http://en.tokipona.org/wiki/suno
[1] http://en.tokipona.org/wiki/What_is_Toki_Pona%3F
https://conlangquest.tumblr.com/post/33991762544/fourth-language-review-toki-pona
[...]
As a language designed to shape the thought processes of its users, it resembles George Orwell's invented language Newspeak. As a simple language with minimal phonology and vocabulary, it resembles Furbish[?] or Lapine[?].
[...]
== History ==
An early version of the language was published online in 2001 by Sonja Lang, and it quickly gained popularity. Early activity took place in a Yahoo! group. Members of the group discussed the language with one another in English, Toki Pona, and Esperanto, proposed changes, and talked about the resources on the tokipona.org site. At its peak member count, the group had a little over 500 members. Messages in the group were archived in the Toki Pona forum using phpBB.
Lang later released an official book on the language, Toki Pona: The Language of Good, in 2014. It is also sometimes referred to as pu in the Toki Pona community. In 2016, the book was also published in French. Although other resources for the language have been created by the community, the major sources for learning continue to be Lang's book and online lessons developed by Bryant Knight or "jan Pije", an early adopter of Toki Pona.
In 2008 an application for an ISO 639-3 code was rejected, with a statement that the language was too young. Another request was rejected in 2018 as the language "does not appear to be used in a variety of domains nor for communication within a community which includes all ages".Toki Pona was the subject of some scientific works, and it has also been used for artificial intelligence and software tools, as well as a therapeutic method for eliminating negative thinking by having patients keep track of their thoughts in the language.
toki pona letter/syllable/word frequency statistics based on #toki-pona-taso on the ma pona pi toki pona discord server. Second file has some stats from "toki pona taso sin" on telegram.
https://gist.github.com/increpare/9aaf57056b857cb44a38d0ff0de9534b
Who speaks toki pona?
JanMato | 2010
toki pona is an artificial language uses for amusement and entertainment on mailing lists, internet forums, blogs and the like. Typical users are geographically located in North America, Europe and Russia. The typical toki pona user is also fluent two or more other natural languages.
While several thousand people have heard of it or expressed casual interest in it, only a few dozen have learned it well enough to write something original and post it to the internet. I estimate that about 50 to 100 people have contributed to the public toki pna corpus (the set of all public writings in toki pona).
Unlike Esperanto, Lojban or Klingon, the toki pona does not at the moment have a significant in person community, yet.
Toki Pona/Morphological typology
https://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Toki_Pona/Morphological_typology
sina o jo
e tenpo sike
tu mila luka en noka
pona !
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TRTKqhyvxNw
tan jan Pite Janseke
tan ma Pesije
#tpe #epansa #toki_ante #toki_pona_kepeken_nanpa_suli
#Janseke
What are the advantages of learning Toki Pona?
https://www.quora.com/What-are-the-advantages-of-learning-Toki-Pona
lipu pi toki pona pi jan Tolin
sitelen musi mi pi toki pona li lon lipu ni.
My toki pona translations/original compositions are on this page.
kule - Original poem
walo
open a!
ale li kama lon!
sina en mi en ante a
li kama tan ijo wan.
laso
kili tan kasi tan ma
li jo e kule ni
ona li lon ale a
li pona tawa mi.
kala li tawa telo
ona li lili li ni
ona li tawa ma
pi kule suli ni.
anpa en sewi la
kule ni li lon
pini en ale la
kule ni li wan.
jelo
sewi li kama ante
ike li lon tan kon
ona li weka e kule
kasi pi wawa lon.
sina o tawa tan ni
olin li suli wan
sina o tawa ma pi
ilo pi kama lon.
wawa ona li pona
e ale e mi e sina
ona a li lon poka
jan a pi tenpo kama.
loje
suno li weka a
pini mute li lon
waso wan li tawa
lon ma pi moli lon.
ken la pali ala
li kama tan sona mi
ken la sina sona
e ike pi kama mi.
sina la mi sona ala
e lon. mi awen tan ni
taso mi pilin e lon a
jan ale li wan li mi.
pimeja
pini li kama lon ale
ike suli a li lon mi
taso mi sona
e wile mi
kule li kama sin.
jan ike - Deftones - Pink Maggit
mi awen tan sina
mi ken wawa nasa e sina a
mi nasa e sina
tan nasa mi
mi lon poka sina
mi olin e jan ni
weka ona li ike
o weka tan mi a
tan awen mi
o utala
sina utala
e ike
o pali ni!
tomo sona
la mi ken lawa
ale
o ante
anu o pini
ni li sina
o utala
sina wile e ona
taso sina
wile ala
tomo sona
la mi ken lawa
ale
o ante a
anu o pini
ni li sina
o ante
anu o pini
ni li sina
o utala
sina utala
e ike
o pali ni!
tomo sona
la mi ken lawa
e ale
sina
sina
sina a
sina a
sina a
sina jan
taso
kon moli - Joy Division - Dead Souls
o weka e wile mi
pi kama ijo mi
pilin mi li mute a
mi sona ala e lon a
ona li toki
li awen toki
li toki mi
ona li toki
suli pini a li lon
kalama ike li lon
wile ona la mi lon nasin
ona li weka ale mi
ona li toki
li awen toki
li toki mi
ona li toki
toki mi
toki mi
toki mi
toki mi
ona li toki
li awen toki
li toki mi
ona li toki
o weka e mi - Deftones - Be Quiet and Drive (Far Away)
ma ni li ike
mi o weka mute
a!
mi ona e sina
o weka e mi
tan ni
tan ni
tan ni
sina a lon poka mi
o weka e mi tan
tan ni
tan ni
tan ni a!
weka!
tan ni
lon li suli ala!
tan ni
lon li suli ala!
tan ni
lon li suli ala!
tan ni
suli ala!
weka!
tan ni
lon li suli ala!
tan ni
lon li suli ala!
tan ni
lon li suli ala!
tan ni
suli ala!
kama ante - Deftones - Change
mi lukin e
kama ante sina
mi lukin ante
tan seli sina
kama ante li lon sina
sina waso ala a
sina pilin pona a
sina kama ante
mi tawa e sina
li pana lon lipu
li weka e waso sina
li kalama
kama ante li lon sina
sina waso ala a
sina pilin pona a
sina kama ante
sina waso ala a
mi lukin sitelen
li lukin ante
li pana ilo
o weka e mi
kama ante li lon sina
sina waso ala a
sina pilin pona a
sina kama ante
sina pilin pona
pilin pona
pilin pona
sina kama ante
sina waso ala a
sina ante
sina ante
sina ante
sina ante
jan mute pi nasin sewi - Three Monks
(Originally in Old Irish, toki pona translation based off the English translation)
jan mute pi nasin sewi li weka tan jan.
ona li tawa ma weka tan pona sewi.
jan li toki ala lon sike suno.
jan li toki e ni tawa jan ante: "mi pona".
jan li toki ala lon sike suno.
jan ante li toki e ni: "mi pona a".
jan li toki ala lon sike suno.
jan ante li toki e ni: "sina awen toki la mi weka tan sina la sina taso li ken weka".
jan pi pona mute - R.E.M. - Shiny Happy People
jan pi pona mute musi
o kama lon jan, jan a, jan a
o pana olin, olin, olin
o tawa lon ma, pona, pona
o pana lon ma pi kama kili
mani li wawa
jan pi pona mute li luka
jan pi pona mute li luka
jan pi pona mute musi
jan la o olin, o olin
o kama luka, kama, kama
ike o ala, pona, pona
o pana pilin pi pona kama
mani li wawa
jan pi pona mute li luka
jan pi pona mute li luka
jan pi pona mute musi
a, musi sin
jan pi pona mute li luka
jan pi pona mute li luka
jan pi pona mute musi
jan pi pona mute li luka
jan a, jan pona a
jan a
https://dublin.ng.netsoc.ie/tokipona.html
#TokiPona #janTolin #toki_musi #anno2019 (estimation)
MONDAY, MARCH 19, 2007
Toki pona
Among weird conlangs I've found, I think Toki pona is an interesting one. It is a minimal language. Like a pidgin, it focuses on simple concepts and elements that are relatively universal among cultures. Toki pona aims to express maximal meaning with minimal complexity. The language has 14 phonemes and only 118 words. It is not designed as an international auxiliary language but is instead inspired by Taoist philosophy.
The 118 offical Toki pona words are: a, akesi, ala, ale (ali), anpa, ante, anu, awen, e, en ijo, ike, ilo, insa, jaki, jan, jelo, jo, kala, kalama, kama, kasi, ken, kepeken, kili, kin, kiwen, ko, kon, kule, kute, kulupu, la, lape, laso, lawa, len, lete, li, lili, linja, lipu, loje, lon, luka, lukin, lupa, ma, mama, mani, meli, mi, mije, moku, moli, monsi, mu, mun, musi, mute, nanpa, nasa, nasin, nena, ni, nimi, noka, o, oko, olin, ona, open, pakala, pali, palisa, pana, pi, pilin, pimeja, pini, pipi, poka, poki, pona, sama, seli, selo, seme, sewi, sijelo, sike, sin, sina, sinpin, sitelen, sona, soweli, suli, suno, supa, suwi, tan, taso, tawa, telo, tenpo, toki, tomo, tu, unpa, uta, utala, walo, wan, waso, wawa, weka, wile.
These words were based on words from English, Tok Pisin, Finnish, Georgian, Dutch, Acadian French, Esperanto, Croatian, Mandarin Chinese, and Cantonese. To see the origines, read here.
You'd be surprised to see how many things can be said with only those words. If you see the official list, each word has several meanings. For example, moli can mean death, to die, to be dead, to kill or even fatal. The precise meaning has to be taken from the context. But even with this polysemy, it is hard to have much things to say. Toki pona solves this with the use of "compund" words. For example, jan means person, and lili means small, little, young. If you combine them, you have jan lili, meaning child.
Toki pona only accepts capitalizing if the word is not in that list. Not even at the begining of a sentence.
There are no propper nouns. Toki pona has propper adjectives. This can be something difficult to understand at first. For example, Norway is a propper noun in English. To talk about that country in Toki pona, you need a noun and a propper adjective. The noun is ma, which means country, and the adjective is Nosiki (capitalized, because it is a word not included in the list. It is adapted to the Toki pona sound system). Then Norway is ma Nosiki (the adjective follows the noun).
This isn't an auxiliary language. And you won't find many speakers around. Then... why bother?! I am not sure. It has an interesting idea.
If you are curious, abut Toki pona, check a short course.
POSTED BY SAYQEEH
lipu pona
by jan Wisin
[...]
This is a distilled overview of the language Toki Pona.
Major concepts of the language are introduced by saying as much as possible with as little as possible.
That is to say, some details are only mentioned or explained by their mere appearance in example sentences. Look carefully!
This guide is intended to be a small and organized view into a minimal language. It covers all of the grammar. Toki Pona is not a precise language, as its 120 words do not give you much precision. It cannot be used to communicate exact details like numbers easily. It is very useful, however, for getting a message down to the core of what it is and what is wanted out of other people.
Toki Pona is easier to learn than it has any right to be.
[...]
Toki Pona
2019/08/31 ~ TORAZAKANA
toki! mi kama sona e toki pona.
Hello! I’m learning the toki pona language.
It is a language with only approximately 120 basic words which you mix and match to form sentences that expresses what you want to say.
Toki pona does not have any native speakers as it is a constructed language created by the Canadian linguist and translator Sonja Lang. Everyone learns from each other in communities on Discord, Reddit, and Facebook.
Toki pona challenges the way you think with its limited vocabulary.
I highly recommend language lovers to give this language a go!
Resources are all scattered about so I have compiled a list of resources that I am using, or am going to use. Do google for more resources though!
Kobi Kai Calev, speaking Toki Pona since 2003, actively using it
Mar 30, 2016
I don't think so; but that depends or your usage of Toki-Pona, and whether you keep it simple (as described here for example: Dialects of toki pona).
Part of what differentiates Toki-Pona from Natural languages: There's a natural instinct or habit - to coin new words and terms - I think this happens in any language and environment, and in a way this simplifies communication, but there's a cost to this simplification - in a way we stop seeing things "as they are" and we see them coloured through these abstract terms we've coined and absorbed.
So - my usage of Toki-Pona - tried to avoid this coining, there's other "Dialects" of Toki-Pona that do the exact opposite - construct word pairs or set-phrases with a pre-set meaning. In my opinion - the very beauty of TP - is the ability to resist the temptation of coining terms, and keep coining them per situation - per conversation partner - and keep "forgetting" or even erasing them, otherwise - this just becomes a cumbersome just-another-language, and things are not stated "as they are" anymore.
In this sense - Toki-Pona is just as simple as some Pidgin languages in a community where they keep being used as Pidgins.
So TP in a sense - is a well documented Pidgin; From my experimentations - I would say it should take about 1.5 month for someone to properly study TP, or at least that's how long it took me, and some friends whom I've observed; It can also thus serve as an self-diagnostic language learning lab, see how long it takes you to properly learn a ~120 word vocab, how is grammar being absorbed, etc.
So - in a phrase - the thing that keeps TP simple, is the counter intuitive resistance to coining new terms, and that shouldn't exist in a natural language.
https://www.quora.com/Does-a-natural-language-as-simple-as-Toki-Pona-exist
Matthew M | 2010
1) Hard to say. Most people who are enthusiastic about toki pona are learning it as their fourth language (typically mother tongue, school, esperanto, then toki pona, sometimes more) It took me two episodes of about 3-4 months each to get to the point where I could read at a reasonable speed and write intelligible, if not grammatically perfect toki pona. It starts out incredibly easy and then after a certain amount of time, you realize certain phrases are really hard to translate without careful thought and research.
2) There is no one to speak with locally. I'm trying to organize an in person meetup in Arlington, Virginia. The closest one gets to conversational toki pona is the IRC chat room, which some people like a lot, but I tend to avoid-- I just don't like IRC. I have grandiose plans of setting up a skype multi-person call in, but so far the planets haven't lined up right for it to happen.
3) The main communities are: the tp forum, the remnants of the tp community on livejournal, a few people on twitter and tokilili.shoutem.com, a couple of independent blogs, a very small group of people on youtube, and possibly a new community on tokipona.shapad.com. Some toki pona users appear in all of these places, some only in one or two. Wikipedia and wikia used to be active with toki pona stuff, but now they are both pretty quiet.
4) There are 125 root words, but one of them--pu--is more akin to a reserved word because it hasn't be defined. There are 100s of proper modifiers, which generally require memorization, such as ma Mewika = USA and ma Losi = Russia. As you can see the proper modifiers often look little like the proper name they draw upon. The number of set phrases one needs to become familiar with is probably in the 3000 range. By set phrases, I mean things like "jan pona", which means "friend", but also "good person". The set phrases are the equivalent to compound words in English, which only sometimes can be understood completely just by looking at the parts.
5) toki pona's users have found many uses for it. For me it is a nice small language that allows me to discover interesting things about how foreign languages work, how my own language works, but without the 2-10 years it takes to become competent or fluent in even the simplest of the natural languages.
Source(s): - The wikipedia article - The tokipona.org wiki and forum - The toki pona corpus (that is the sum total of everything ever written in toki pona)
https://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100904165602AAiZwaX
ihr | 2009
toki pona constructed language?
anyone speak it?
just wondering...
i've considered learning it...even though it's not really useful lol...simply because i find the basic concept behind it to be interesting...
[...]
Matthew M | 2009
About 100-200 people have learned enough toki pona to write and publish something in toki pona on the web. Toki pona is unusual in that in a few days of study you can say and write many somethings (as compared to Chinese, where a similar level of competency might take 3 months of preparation). Reading is another story-- I've often noticed it is easier to write toki pona that to read it.
As for usefulness, toki pona was designed to be useful to treat depression-- there's no evidence one way or the other, but it is an innovative sort of talk-therapy. If you are in a philosophical mood, it also has some promise as a sort of meditative language that not only clears your mind, but makes it hard to clutter your mind with stuff (because initially you just won't have a suitable word for it). Eventually one becomes competent in the language and you lose out a bit on the mind clearing benefits.
Of the various conlangs with any community at all (esperanto, na'vi, Klingon, toki pona, lojban), toki pona is pretty active-- this compares with zero action going on with the vast majority of other conlangs that have been published, and as someone will probably point out, the number of users of any one conlangs is tiny compared to the number of people that have some fluency in esperanto.
Despite it being easy to get going, eventually one realizes that it a real language and fluency takes years and I don't think anyone is fluent to the extent that they could do real time translation of English or other feats that we might expect from someone who claimed to be fluent in both, say, English and Spanish.
I hope to see you on the forums!
mi wile lukin e ni: sitelin sina li lon ilo sitelen pi toki pona!
Source(s): My source is the tokipona forums, the tokipona.org website, the wikipedia article, the toki pona wikia and the google custom search engine for toki pona.
https://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100304224024AAKKPH1
*Thinking* in toki pona?
toki!
2019
I have a question that I suppose is related to the validity of the Sapir-Whorf hypothesis. Since toki pona is a rather limited language in terms of its capabilities to express complex, nuanced emotions, theories, ideas, etc., do any experienced/fluent toki pona speakers find themselves able to think in toki pona directly, or do they think in their native language and then attempt to translate/break it down into simpler toki pona sentences?
I feel like if I only knew toki pona, I would never be able to fully express myself... to myself. Inside of my own head. I am curious if those that experience a "stream of consciousness" directly in toki pona think that their own mode of thinking changes as well, and if this limited ability to fully express oneself is really a problem when speaking at all.
Hope that makes sense and isn't too ramble-y :)
Dresdom
jan Tomen
Yeah we can think in toki pona. I don't feel limited when doing it, but it definitely "tastes" different.The Sapir-Whorf thing was already discredited in its strong form. It certainly has some effect, but nothing too big. Not having a word for "communism", for example, doesn't make you incapable of thinking about it, and having extra color words only makes you better at differentiating them by a very small margin (but makes it faster to communicate).
If any, thinking in toki pona makes you take some more time to express abstract concepts because you need to describe them instead of using a word as a precise code for them. I find it makes me understand my own feelings better. I can't just say I'm jealous, I have to say I feel bad because I saw my partner talking to another person an I'm afraid they'll love them more than they love me. Having to describe it makes me introspect more, or choose what not to say because I deem it irrelevant.
You don't have a word for the feeling of comfortable laziness that you have to battle when your alarm sounds in winter and your bed is warm but you know the hallway will be cold. That doesn't make you incapable of recognizing it, experiencing it, talking about it or dealing with it. You just need to take some more time to describe it to others than if we had, say, a word like "wakelayness".
Spanish has the word "sobremesa" for the space of time after a meal that you spend talking with friends and relatives over empty dishes before considering the meal "officially over". Not having that word doesn't make you unable to deal with the concept.
soweli
I like to pretend I am advanced :) I probably speak an older version of the language - toki pona majuna, if you will.
Yes, I can think in toki pona without translating from another language (or I could at one point). For my personal toki pona journey, I had to come to the realization that words in toki pona largely don't behave the same in other languages. In English, we have a separate word for good, a separate word for simple, yet another word for fixing something broken. In toki pona, we have 'pona'. I could be totally off-base here (but I don't think I am), but pona does not just mean 'good' or 'simple' or 'to fix', but rather all three simultaneously. Thus, the translation of 'toki pona' mentally transforms from 'the good language' to something more like 'a [good|simple|fixing] [language|speech-pattern]'. Thinking about toki pona was brought about by dwelling on the proverb 'ale li pona', which is still one of my favorite sayings because it is three words and 9 letters, yet it means so much. That isn't to say that one can't say specific things, however. 'pipi pi ma mama li lili' will always be 'the bug of the motherland is small'.
Also, when I learned toki pona, it was taught that ike li ike. It's good to take things, and break them down into simpler things. Obviously you wouldn't want to be communicating health issues to your doctor, or describing scientific theories in toki pona. This is not what the language is for, and if that is your goal then you're going to have a bad time. But talking about your day, why you are feeling what you are feeling, this is completely possible.
So, tl;dr, not putting toki pona words into small boxes but rather letting them be open, plus shying away from the complex in favor of the simple, greatly helped me express things in the way that I want to, and in a pona way.
[ANONYMOUS]
That's a perspective I hadn't considered. I think I wasn't considering the purpose of the language or the benefits of having words with many, if not infinite, meanings. Thanks for sharing!
jan pi nimi ni wawa
I disagree, "pipi pi ma mama li lili" could mean "bugs from the land of parents are young"
I personally would never use ma mama, I would stay "ma pi open mi" but the rules on using multiple pi in a sentence aren't well defined so it's hard to use.
Continue this thread
SGP_Alpha-Centauri
toki!
Apart from the SW hypothesis (which may or may not be true, and I personally wouldn't intend to discuss it either)... it of course isn't impossible to think in toki pona, but there definitely are some difficulties.
Not an advanced speaker/learner myself. But I still did some thinking in it before, as a part of the learning process, and also because of wanting to try something new. As for very simple things like drinking water or eating some food, it was easy. Because even if any particular TP noun is highly ambiguous, one still knows the intended meaning.
But as for anything advanced, like "there is something I like to do now, but before I am able to start, I still need to finish something even more important"... how could that even be worded in TP in an easy way? Just saying. I am very aware of jan Sonja Lang's goals of TP and her intended scope.
For those of us who know something about programming/coding (like the thread starter, I suppose): some programming languages are "Turing complete", others aren't. And Turing completeness has got its human languages counterpart. Do you know what I am hinting to? But this isn't meant as a TP criticism. I do like utilizing that tongue for certain, although limited, purposes.
Dresdom
jan Tomen
mi o pali e ijo pona la mi wile pini e ijo suli. pini ala la mi ken ala open e ijo pona.
jan pi nimi ni wawa
"there is something I like to do now, but before I am able to start, I still need to finish something even more important
Are you thinking this to yourself or explaining it for others?
To myself.
mi wile, taso ken ala. mi wili pini.
For saying it to someone else.
mi wile pali e ijo, taso mi ken ala open e ni. la mi wile pini e pali ante pi pona.
jan pi nimi ni wawa
mi pilin kepeken toki pona.
jan pi nimi ni wawa
mi pilin e ni: mi toki tawa mi la mi ken toki pona pona. mi toki e kasi taso. la kasi seme? sina wile ala sona taso mi wile sona a. ni li pona tawa mi taso.
I think of it like this, I can simplify when thinking to myself. I just think "kasi". Which plant? You wouldn't be able to know, but I would know. It would be clear only to me.
Basically, you can think in a language much easier than expressing yourself in a language. Any time you're had something on the top of your tongue or knew exactly what you wanted to say but couldn't find the words? You were thinking fine still, it was only communication that gets difficult. Education using toki pona is hard, theorizing and philosophizing is perfectly simple.
elmanchosdiablos
According to some, you can't be considered fluent in a language until you're capable of thinking in it.
I myself am not there (yet)
bashandy
Sapir-Whorf hypothesis may/may not be tested in monolingual people from different linguistic backgrounds. Toki Pontardawe was used to help jan Sona simplify her thoughts, not as a language to test Sapir-Whorf Hypothesis.
I guess what jan sona meant is that if one is struggling with complex idea then tries to put it in toki pona one would either simplify the idea or drop it. The third option is to drop toki pona itself.
Jan Sona is not claiming control over the language, so currently some try to work on the language to extend its abilities and to test it to discuss various topics. Others try to keep it as simple as possible. In both situations, the language has challenges if left to its own simplicity it may become stagnant as after a few decades people will exhaust its limits. If it becomes more sophisticated it loses its essence.
These are not problems with the the language, it's just a reflection of the complexity of our thinking and of the world around us. I guess it is interesting idea to try to simplify our thoughts for some time. The dilemma comes when takes toki pona out of context to be a way of life, or an ial or a proof of concept.
https://www.reddit.com/r/tokipona/comments/ay4vzh/thinking_in_toki_pona/
Webosoof
Joined Oct 2019
