Do you think it works to have an account and use commercial things like Facebook in order to get your Free Software / Freedom movement going in a way you would like to spread it?
@UniversalVortices@mastodon.social @freeschool
By using nonfree software to support free software, you are making a redundant moot point for free software.
The best way to promote is to do without nonfree- otherwise you're just promoting the case against it
Do you think it works to have an account and use commercial things like Facebook in order to get your Free Software / Freedom movement going in a way you would like to spread it?
@lucifargundam @UniversalVortices@mastodon.social @freeschool
That is the irony. Lots of FLOSS projects have proprietary social media accounts to promote their project.
In the end it depends what your goal is. Proprietary social media might be a good way to hook new customers. One could for example watermark the content or only create a small snippet. Though this will only really create passive engagement.
Active engagement would be the better approach. Find potential customers on proprietary social media. Meetup in a way that you are using FLOSS software or communicate your interests in FLOSS software/projects.
There are two big concerns I hear all the time:
1. "I never knew of an open source alternative" or better "I never knew of open source".
2. "I just want things to work".
Firstly, if you don't know what you don't know, then no matter how much effort you put in to market yourself as completely free, you will never spark the interest of someone who has never heard of FLOSS. (Ignorance)
Secondly, is just laziness.
Do you think it works to have an account and use commercial things like Facebook in order to get your Free Software / Freedom movement going in a way you would like to spread it?
@barefootstache @lucifargundam @UniversalVortices@mastodon.social
Good Points! I'll add them to my lists! lol...
"I never knew of open source" rofl
(which I guess is our lifelong 'job')
and "I just want things to work" (which is probably true for us maybe in non-tech fields IF everyone has a blind-spot but maybe Techie have less blind spots / more awareness and ignorances )
Do you think it works to have an account and use commercial things like Facebook in order to get your Free Software / Freedom movement going in a way you would like to spread it?
@freeschool @barefootstache @UniversalVortices@mastodon.social
I guess when you put it that way you have a point.
When's the last time Mozilla shoved "We're open source" in the face of the average user when launching Firefox? It would have to hit them in the face in order for it to remotely register into their memory.
Do you think it works to have an account and use commercial things like Facebook in order to get your Free Software / Freedom movement going in a way you would like to spread it?
@freeschool @barefootstache @universalvortices@lugnasad.eu @universalvortices@turkum.site @UniversalVortices@leafposter.club Relevant comment from the Sofware Freedom Conservancy:::
https://lwn.net/Articles/899612/
Do you think it works to have an account and use commercial things like Facebook in order to get your Free Software / Freedom movement going in a way you would like to spread it?
@lucifargundam @barefootstache @universalvortices@lugnasad.eu @universalvortices@turkum.site @UniversalVortices@leafposter.club
That was useful thanks!
Was thinking it might be more conclusive or definitive but I'll re-read it and have a look at links... (haven't yet)
Copy below of the text (no hyperlinks)
SFC's use of Twitter.
Posted Jul 1, 2022 13:23 UTC (Fri) by bkuhn (subscriber, #58642)
In reply to: Software Freedom Conservancy: Give Up GitHub: The Time Has Come! by Karellen
Parent article: Software Freedom Conservancy: Give Up GitHub: The Time Has Come!
Karellen, I feel you could have made your point with less sarcasm, but raising the question that SFC organizationally uses Twitter is a reasonable thing to ask about. But, I would encourage in future that you perhaps frame your inquiry with some like “I do feel it as somewhat hypocritical that SFC has called for folks to give up GitHub, but they aren't calling for folks to give up Twitter — and in fact SFC is using Twitter actively!” That would be a respectful way to ask your inquiry.
Speaking as the person at SFC who's primary job (as Policy Fellow) is to analyze and consider and recommend policy of how we approach these proprietary software situations, I'll note that we now live in a difficult and complex world where it has become increasingly difficult (at least in industrialized countries) to engage with communities and pursue the normal functions of life without interacting with proprietary software. Personally (outside of my work at SFC), I refuse to use Twitter also. It was a difficult decision for SFC to continue using Twitter (which, BTW, I prefer to call Agrawaland — and I used to call Dorseyville (and I guess I'll be calling Musktown soon?) — all to note that Twitter is not a democratic platform, it is a for-profit company's property under the autocratic control of its CEO).
My colleague Karen Sandler and I gave two keynotes (at FOSDEM 2019 and 2020, respectively) about the challenges FOSS activists face in choosing when to use or refuse to use proprietary software. These are hard issues to decide. In fact, we internally talked quite a bit while planning the Give Up GitHub campaign to determine if GitHub had crossed enough lines that they are substantially worse in their behavior than other proprietary software companies. We believe they are, which is why we launched the campaign, but we understand that you may have a different opinion.
Meanwhile, I'll put it on the agenda for future blog posts that I should write explaining how SFC came to the decision to keep participating in Agrawaland — particularly after they previous regime (Dorsey's) cut off the federation features abruptly (which lead to identi.ca's demise). Thanks so much for your inquiry and this will make a useful blog post. I can't promise a timeline for it as we have a lot of writing in the pipeline, but I will look into it!
@lucifargundam
Well you would think so... and trying to be fair in and less bias in this post I just see a few very good people really going for it and so wonder about it... sometimes things can work driving hard or doing the opposite or helps to see why...
What I've summarised from talks is that there are more obvious tangible people 'over there' so it can feel more effective or the good work to try and fetch or 'bring people over to the othe side'... which does seem possible (while sacrificing almost your own principles in order to gain something else which is +/- in overall reward and hard to measure...) but yeah I can definitely see that while in some cases (or arguable most, and often most of one's post) doesn't work (at least in the moment or is demoted / almost muted in algorithms amplification / filtering) so it can give those people false look that it's online even if people do or don't see it --->(it's my bias that it's false feedback or the signals where it might look and feel good is there but it's still not really working).
I mean they also wouldn't let that happen right! Systems are quite tight nowadays..,. if they saw even 1% crossing over they would make some excuse for it, after all it's their bizness/money people are messing with not going to just take it (and so my thoughts are also it's ineffective or people get kicked and go back)
So people can just end up listening to you 'over there' and not on Mastodon... and not really changing (it's like people reading the next bad thing endlessly)
Real conversion needs measuring
I think people who sacrifice themselves consistently think this crossing to the other side is needed / warranted... and almost in physical analogy I could imagine it if it was a quick process like rescuing someone from water / stealing people back / kidnapping / converting / educating etc... but yeah I'd like to really know personally / keep a chalk board of how many exactly message me after getting an account on Mastodon and seeing the Twitter / Facebook / insta deleted!!!! Otherwise really it's more than likely not working.
I trust the speed of ignorance (from people generally if there are already there and attached to friends and family) and also how strong their computers are tracking people and even a problem person like tracing people back to their nests... which doesn't help with a flag saying YOU ARE BAD! lol... perhaps a bit naive and gestural (which work to get an individual mad, but big company probably not).
I'm not speaking for everyone here but if it could be easy for them to analyse or personal chalk up then I'd backup some sacrificing people to absorb the damage... but without that kind of robust stat or person observing it is less sensible... also giving the game away too early / showing flags...
In short I'm trying to look at it objectively :)
Oh yeah I was going to mention other false-positives from perspective of person 'using the system against itself@, sorry- here a list and website link:
http://freeschool.0id.org/using-the-system-against-itself/
--->I reach a lot of people" (could be true but conversion is important
--->"If we don't use their system then how will they know about it"
(there are other ways to hunt someone, arguably the short cut is really to easy and we have to bear our cross door to door / email / our own website / or somehow (any suggestion - it is looking thin on our side though 1 person is still one for sure versus 1 from maybe 100 on Twitter / FB and them immediately signing up an account but then still going back to it realising 'nobody' is here / still not breaking the will they need to have)
---> (some more reasons I'm sure I've wrote online but you get the idea / probably heard them)