#COP26 #climate_change #planet #earth #choice #binary #capitalism #catastrophe #uk #global #future #death
As posted on Diaspora Europe on 27th October 2021.
๐ณ๐ฑ
@iankenway I agree with the notion that binary choices are short sighted and generally wrong... I strongly disagree with the notion that capitalism is an inherently harmful form of government. In fact most things that people blame as hallmarks of capitalism are in fact by their nature a quality that is anti-capitalism. For example corruption caused by greed, when that occurs you no longer have a capitalism because corruption implies manipulation which implies you dont have a free market, which is what defines capitalism.
@freemo
@iankenway
I agree with Freemo. The problem is not capitalism in general but its contemporary laissez-faire, neoliberal and crony capitalist forms. In the George Monbiot article linked in Ian's previous tweet, most if not all of his proposals, including the wealth tax and the idea of public luxury and private sufficiency, are quite compatible with social democracy, and thus with some form of capitalism.
In my opinion, the meme itself is more likely to alienate than convince, because while some people will associate the use of the word "capitalism" solely with the aforementioned forms, others will associate the use with any system involving some private ownership of capital. The people who are undecided on the matter of climate change action will be more likely to have the latter association, and will be more likely to recoil at the meme than agree with it.
I strongly disagree on wealth tax, that is not healthy for a society and people having wealth, even a lot of it, is not an indication of an unfair society.
I do agree with the fact that there is a problem where the poor dont get as fair a chance to rise up out of poverty as they should. I also agree markets arent as free as they should be both in terms of corruption as well as excessive regulation. But wealth tax implies that excessive wealth is the problem, it is not. At worst it may be a symptom of other inherent problems.
@freemo
To be clear, I am still undecided on wealth taxes myself.
The point is that few, if any, of the proposals I have heard from Monbiot or most other people in his crowd are even incompatible with at least some form of capitalism, so saying that capitalism itself is the issue rather than the particular form of capitalism seen now (or, as some other than me might argue, specific swathes of policy rather than the entire form of capitalism used) is at best hasty and at worst motivated reasoning.
@iankenway
I would argue a wealth tax is directly contrary to healthy capitalism or capitalism at all. It penalizes anyone who makes money, thats the opposite of a free market where making or loosing money is considered natural and desirable for the population.
@freemo
I'd agree that a general wealth tax is certainly not conducive to a market economy and very likely not a good idea, but one can still have it without getting rid of private ownership of the means of production.
Monbiot's proposal is presumably to do it on people with more than a certain amount. I am still undecided on whether this is a good idea; while it would probably lower inequality, it seems to be a bandaid on the problems of corruption, regulatory capture, and monopolization that seem to be what got much of the West into the current mess in the first place.
@iankenway
