@freemo the thing is, we live in a time where two people can see the exact same thing, read the exact same words, and come away with exactly opposite ideas about what they just saw or read.

So in that sort of environment... the answer to your question depends on who you ask.

It's just the state of society, that we can look at the same weather report and disagree about whether it's raining or not.

@volkris Very true of course... but i care less about if there was evidence you may disagree with or find less damning and more about hearing about what evidence, questionable or otherwise, that may have came up that is less speculative.

@freemo Yeah, asking people to put their evidence on their table sounds like a pretty good idea.

But it does get frustrating when you ask if there has been evidence, and people were reply that there absolutely has, and what they present isn't evidence at all, and you point that out, and they say it is, and at that point there's nowhere else to go with it.

It's raining outside!
What's your evidence?
Well here's a bucket full of water from the rain!
...That bucket is empty.
No it's full of rain! Look at all this water in it!

Siiiigh

I refer to it as the book club theory. We all showed up to the book club, and we all read books with the same title, but the plot lines were different in different people's copies, so it's pretty darn hard to discuss the book.