volkris @volkris@qoto.org

@freemo Yeah, the way I figure if we elect someone to office who is really into dictatorship, well, that's really going to suck for them because they are going to spend every day in the Oval Office lamenting that they don't have dictatorial powers

We probably shouldn't elect such a person, but if we do, honestly that person is probably going to be the worst off from it.

@Hyolobrika @realcaseyrollins

@Hyolobrika maybe the thing that you are missing is that in a system like the US they don't get that power merely because they get elected.

In the US it is fundamental to the system that no, we absolutely don't trust ANYONE with such power.

It doesn't matter if you get elected, it doesn't matter if you really really want the power, it doesn't matter if you think you have the power, you still don't have the power, because the US system was designed specifically to make sure you don't have that power.

That's a huge problem with this whole " democracy is on the ballot" nonsense. No, it's not, because the US system was designed specifically to make such a thing impossible.

So I would say that if the people want to elect somebody promising things that they wouldn't have the authority to do at all, then the people are wasting their votes and they're going to be disappointed, but that's really the long and short of it.

Might as well vote for the candidate that is promising to flap his arms and fly to the ceiling.

We should absolutely educate the public on civics so that they know those promises are unfulfillable, but if they want to vote for someone based on a promise that he can't keep, well...

@freemo @realcaseyrollins

@freemo

Notice that I used the plural 🙂
This is not merely one friend, but the prospective offered by many different working historians during their get togethers on, for example, the sidelines of conferences.

@Hyolobrika @realcaseyrollins

@accretionist@techhub.social based on what I've seen of governmental mismanagement from the inside, not Biden.

I've never seen it as bad as under his administration.

So who knows? There's a good chance I'll just write myself in.

I'll vote if nothing else just to register my protest.

@Jayslacks

@dontreportme

Most of the work that I have in mind is scientific, working for research organizations that the administration has direct control over.

The science community is having major problems conducting research under this administration, problems I haven't seen in decades, as the administrators just don't know what they're doing.

And it's a slight aside that another problem is when under this administration they continued to throw money at efforts while at the same time preventing them from moving forward, meaning that people just get paid not to work, with society's resources being squandered.

It's a giant mess, but I guess the press has plenty of more important things to cover with so much of the world seeming to be on fire at the moment.

@Jayslacks

@Hyolobrika @freemo

I always find definitional arguments to be a bit uninteresting, but FWIW the professional, trained historian, academic friends of mine have mentioned that fascism is basically a useless word historically because it doesn't have a workable, agreed upon definition, so they sound like they would rather people just never use that word again unless maybe in reference to Mussolini specifically.

@realcaseyrollins

@lauren

Oh let me clarify.

It's better for everybody if they know enough to not be afraid of things that don't threaten them. I think that should be a pretty uncontroversial stance.

So we should work educate everybody so that they don't end up fearing things they don't understand when those things are not worth fearing.

I am happy to make that general assertion. Do you disagree? I suspect you don't.

That is all that I would capture in my attitude.

If people hate that stance, if people hate the idea that maybe they should be given a reprieve from being afraid of things they shouldn't be afraid of, well ok.

But in general i suspect most people don't like being afraid of things for no reason.

@robryk your reply reminds me of coming across a post around here recently where someone was defending Fauci's approach to communicating about COVID on the basis of, The public needed to hear messages of certainty even if the science was uncertain.

Yeah I agree it's extremely important to recognize that different people respond differently to different rhetorical tactics. Some people are convinced one way and some another.

@lauren

@lauren Well then great!

Read the room and try to educate people based on what seems to be the attitude of those you are speaking to.

Here I kind of assumed you were smart enough that I could be frank and not have to mince words diplomatically.

Depending on who I was speaking to yeah I might choose different words. But at the end of the day, indulge their fears is probably the most concise if undiplomatic way I could describe it.

@ent have you ever considered the possibility that Mussolini wasn't actually that smart?

@freemo @Hyolobrika @realcaseyrollins

@Free_Press you address them through engagement, slowly showing cracks in their perspectives until the invitations to join reality are accepted.

But you don't defeat it by name calling and othering.

@ent

Of course voting matters. We recognize the winners of votes.

You might not like the way votes turn out, and you might argue that corporations press us to vote certain ways, or that we are misinformed and so we vote based on misinformation, or you might raise a ton of other similar complaints, but at the end of the day the most important part stands:

We still respect the results of elections.

The people still get what they vote for, even if they may vote for a really really really really really really really stupid things based on really really bad influences, if you must.

@freemo @Hyolobrika @realcaseyrollins

@lauren and don't forget to hit the thumbs down button, just in case the algorithm cares about it.

. No idea if it actually does

@lauren or doctors, engineers, teachers, basically anybody who might not play into the confirmation bias.

We need a better informed population and we need to work on building up, helping to improve people's lives.

However we go about it.

@MisterWanko they're not taking apartments away from them.

There was no them to have the apartments taken away from.

But if you would like an apartment and you would like to rent it at the market rate, here's the city council stepping in and telling you you can't.

Yes, that is a government problem. And at any moment government could remove that barrier and let you rent the apartment.

Until then, the government has created a situation that promotes vacancies.

@todayilearned

@realcaseyrollins tragedy of the Commons there

@freemo

@MisterWanko It literally is since as it says given the government restrictions on renting out the apartments they are pushed towards keeping them empty.

Those restrictions can be dropped any day and Lord knows the landlords would love to take in income from renting them out.

So any day of the week, let's have those restrictions on renting dropped.

@todayilearned

@lauren do you mean in terms of health effects of the little radios?

In that case it seems like the simpler way, or at least the healthier way, to make some people more comfortable is through education about how little health risk there is from those devices.

That's rather than indulging their fears.

@Hyolobrika keep in mind that there is a speech element to barring a person from office if you prevent people from expressing, through voting, their preference for that person.

This is one huge element in the current Trump drama that there's a huge difference between kicking him off a ballot versus letting him take office if elected, but the two issues are being muddled together.

@freemo @realcaseyrollins