Erik Haugen @ech@qoto.org

@Barbramon1 @TomShafShafer @georgetakei But SPLC says weird things like that with poor evidence regularly. I think the most you can say about Proud Boys is that indeed there are white supremacists/antisemites in the group. (Notably McInnes, the founder!)

Anyway: this is splitting hairs a bit. If someone is attacking you violently or committing other criminal acts maybe the most important question isn't "hmm, is this person a white supremacist?"

But, it does matter in some contexts to get these questions right, so I note all available evidence suggests Tarrio (and PB officially) are not white supremacist.

@Barbramon1 @TomShafShafer @georgetakei There are plenty of people with Spanish names who are white supremacists. Tarrio of course isn't one of them, he's a completely different category of violent criminal. (Turns out there's more than one flavor of political violence, who knew.)

@AlisonCreekside Video makes a great point about how much free press he gets.

@post @freemo @trinsec @khird @vixxo @feld What's this about having to respect opinions? This might be tangential to your point, or you mean something specific by "respect", but I've certainly heard opinions (on technical topics) that I don't "respect".

@jann @genecowan Why is he in trouble? I can't figure out why anyone is in trouble from this article, except perhaps the lawyer that represented too many people at once? But I couldn't quite figure that one out either.

@vixxo @post @freemo @feld Yeah I'm sure that's true; just like before administering a flu test one always puts on n95 respirators/etc. And gets trained to do it properly. I think it's clear that is helpful in reducing spread.

That doesn't mean surgical masks or cloth masks protect against these diseases, or me re-using a surgical mask that I leave in my car for a few days is at all a good idea.

@marleybits39@mastodon.world @jimdoppke @KFuentesGeorge The study in the post you're replying to is literally about housing assistance, though.

I mean, I get your point, but ... data?

@feld @grumpy I don't know, they could conceivably be useful for surgeons hovering over open wounds and simultaneously ineffective for slowing the spread of certain respiratory illnesses.

@feld @grumpy I don't think anyone is suggesting that surgeons stop wearing masks.

@shrockp9 Yeah, or Whoopi Goldberg re. Polanski.

Although if I may be permitted to divine intent I think the point being attempted in these two cases is nowhere near "it's a property crime against the father". (And to my point, it's worth noting Akin lost, almost surely because of his stupid comment.)

Others noted adjacent phenomena like harassment and catcalling: indeed a lot of people are pretty oblivious as to why those kinds of things are harmful. But overall we've come a long way since a lot of the events described in the thread.

@msglincoln @Teri_Kanefield But is it necessary? I mean, there are a lot of shocking things in this thread! Like: someone in the 80s saying if you were more submissive then he wouldn't have to beat you, or rape being a property crime against the father – but like I'm pretty sure >95% of people in the US are against those things, and very enthusiastically so.

Who is holding the implied position that this thread is arguing against?

Coulter certainly doesn't take the position that Kanefield implies she is taking, for example. (read again what she said, she's not being particularly unclear.)

I suggest that making bizarre caricatures of your political opponents is unlikely to be useful.

@ManitouRyan @georgetakei No, there's no possible way to read his comment like that. (Read it and see!)

I mean, the point remains it is deeply weird to even mention their immigration status in the statement, especially considering they were not (at least one wasn't, in any case).

Bad, but not *that* bad, you know?

@kegill @rbreich Which illustrates how nonsense @rbreich's point is. 😂

@TootUncommon@mas.to @Sfwmson my point is more like I don't think very many people were paying 94% on much of their income. Today, the top rates in some states add up to around 50% (fed + state). But like if you pay that on some large fraction of your wealth you're kind of a chump.

@Z_Zed_Zed So any criticism of Harris whatsoever is actually secret racism. Got it.

@Z_Zed_Zed no. There's more to Harris and Haley than "brown" and "woman". They're both powerful politicians who push real policies that can make a real difference, good or bad, to a lot of people. This kind of oversimplification is just harmful.