Void Abyss @voidabyss@qoto.org
Joined Aug 2021
@angelobottone This is a crime against humanity! No other words can describe this madness!
Void Abyss
boosted
CW Long post. Original content.
How parents of DS children are subtly directed toward abortion
There has been little reaction to the news that 95pc of babies diagnosed with Down Syndrome before birth at the Rotunda hospital are subsequently aborted in England.
The response to these horrendous figures has been silence or fatalism. For some, it is an individual “choice” to be respected. There is nothing to be worried about or, even when people find the figures regrettable, little can be done.
“I don’t have a view on whether that is the right thing. We don’t advocate for it, that is just the lived experience”, said prof Fergal Malone, master of the Rotunda.
Is it true? Is it really a purely personal choice, without outside influence or expectations from others? Two recent studies on the experience of parents of children with DS indicate otherwise.
Irish research published last year interviewed eight people following the birth of a child with DS. Some praised the doctors and nurses, but others said the information they received was too medically focused and too negative. It is very hard to believe the same does not happen to couples who are told their baby has DS before it is born.
“Don’t come in with a list of negatives, all the negatives that were put in your head initially we never expected her to be this good now”, said one of the interviewed mothers.
She recalls: “We received purely negative information that she could have this or that, …”
A father said, “Doctors should show compassion when they are delivering the news, have patience and don’t be rushing in and out”.
A Danish study spoke to parents who were told their babies had Down Syndrome before they were born. In Denmark, almost all children with DS are aborted.
The study notes: “Following the diagnosis, the couples were generally critical of the information provided by the hospital. Some felt that the health professionals had painted an unnecessarily grim picture of Down Syndrome based on what couples perceived as outdated information. … Some felt that there was an unnecessary focus on potential diseases and additional diagnoses when the couple was more interested in their potential for living a fulfilling life.”
Participants in the study report feeling pressure from health professionals they encountered to abort, or else that they were presented with overly negative information about their babies.
The research found that “couples felt that termination of pregnancy had been taken for granted following the diagnosis: ‘As the obstetrician sat down, she put those abortion application forms on the table in front of her’”, recalls a mother.
Even conveying apparently neutral information, such as presenting what other couples generally do, can condition parents. We tend to imitate others. Social expectations can be subtle and unconscious.
“Maybe there’s something wrong with me since I don’t just do what 98pc of all people would do”, said a Danish mother in the study, who decided to have the baby.
“The high percentage of terminations in Denmark was a source of doubt and uncertainty during the decision-making process. This left the couples feeling vulnerable”, it notes.
“Why is Down Syndrome the disability [considered] socially acceptable to terminate? And how do we come back from that?”, asks actress Sally Phillips in her documentary “Prenatal Genetic Testing” where she investigates how Non-Invasive Prenatal Tests have increased the number of babies with DS, and other genetic or chromosomal anomalies, who are being aborted. Phillips has a son with Down Syndrome.
These tests, which can take place in the first trimester of pregnancy, are becoming more affordable and available. They can be used to prepare families to welcome a child with medical anomalies, or they can be used to get rid of them, as almost always happens when a diagnosis of DS is given. A proper ethical debate about those prenatal tests has still to happen in Ireland.
In a society that has normalised abortion, the main way to fight the progressive elimination of children with DS is for doctors to portray life with the condition, and life for the parents of such a child, in far more positive terms than seems to be the case at the moment. The medical professionals claim to be neutral about their use, but being not directive isn’t enough when society goes in one direction only.
Certainly, a national debate is called for.
@ParanoidFactoid @kevinrns underrated comment
@freemo
>You be as cautious as you want, its just important to be careful about trying to sell that caution as something justified by the science.
That's your determination, the scientific research and the clinical trials on this matter are still on going, whether you want to acknowledge that fact or not.
* A Phase 1/2/3 Study to Evaluate the Safety, Tolerability, and Immunogenicity of an RNA Vaccine Candidate Against COVID-19 in Healthy Children and Young Adults
https://beta.clinicaltrials.gov/study/NCT04816643
* Moderna mRNA-1273 Observational Pregnancy Outcome Study
https://beta.clinicaltrials.gov/study/NCT04958304
I am relying scientific experts opinion on this topic as well as research studies and case studies therefore my concerns are justified and backed up by science not social conformity or peer pressure.
Expert opinion:
* Paul A. Offit, MD
https://en.wikipedia.org//wiki/Paul_Offit
https://www.fda.gov/media/117731/download
Member of FDA advisory board
* Bivalent Covid-19 Vaccines — A Cautionary Tale
https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMp2215780%EF%BF%BC
Research studies:
- The Incidence of Myocarditis and Pericarditis in Post COVID-19 Unvaccinated Patients—A Large Population-Based Study
https://www.mdpi.com/2077-0383/11/8/2219
- Myocarditis Cases Reported After mRNA-Based COVID-19 Vaccination in the US From December 2020 to August 2021
https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2788346
- **Myopericarditis After COVID-19 mRNA Vaccination Among Adolescents and Young Adults
A Systematic Review and Meta-analysis December 5, 2022**
https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamapediatrics/fullarticle/2798866?guestAccessKey=849e80f0-4a29-4d04-9e1f-34c73224f8c9&utm_source=silverchair&utm_campaign=jama_network&utm_content=car_weekly_highlights&cmp=1&utm_medium=email
- Covid-19 vaccination BNT162b2 temporarily impairs semen concentration and total motile count among semen donors
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/andr.13209
* Extended SARS-CoV-2 RBD booster vaccination induces humoral and cellular immune tolerance in mice
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2589004222017515
Case studies:
- COVID-19 Vaccination-Induced Ventricular Fibrillation in an Afebrile Patient With Brugada Syndrome
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9623033/
- Case report: Myocarditis with nonsustained ventricular tachycardia following COVID-19 mRNA vaccination in a female adolescent
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9720276/pdf/fped-10-995167.pdf
- Torsades de pointes following vaccination for COVID-19
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8993415/
>But at this point it has undergone all the same tests as any medication and there isnt much science to suggest caution is anymore justified than with any other medication or vaccine really.
The safety profile of the mRNA vaccines is not set in stone and will continue to be questioned as more data is reveled and research conducted, the same way as any medication really e.g. Bextra.
>On April 7, 2005, Pfizer withdrew Bextra from the U.S. market on recommendation by the FDA, citing an increased risk of heart attack and stroke and also the risk of a serious, sometimes fatal, skin reaction.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valdecoxib
Pfizer drug breach ends in biggest US crime fine
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2009/sep/02/pfizer-drugs-us-criminal-fine
@empiricism This is an example were that plastics end up.
The plastics bottling companies need to pay for this!
Void Abyss
boosted
@Sabcat wow karma
@0 That's a reasonable take on the current situation.
@freemo
> Its important to note, as well, this issue was discovered before the vaccines had final (non-emergecy use) approval. So still well within the time we expect these sort of minor things to pop up.
I already mentioned this issue in my orignal post pointing to Pfizer own clinical trial data.
>- CUMULATIVE ANALYSIS OF POST-AUTHORIZATION ADVERSE EVENT REPORTS OF PF-07302048 (BNT162B2) RECEIVED THROUGH 28-FEB-2021
https://phmpt.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/11/5.3.6-postmarketing-experience.pdf
>In short there is nothing to indicate the safety of the vaccine is still in question, quite the opposite that by this point the risks are very well known and its safe to say that it is safe with high confidence.
I respect your opinion, but I value excess precaution as I am looking forward to more research studies on this matter.
> but to claim they are dangerous is a huge leap, nor supported by anything you posted.
I never claimed that the vaccines are dangerous.
The main point of my post is that the safety profile of the **mRNA vaccines** are debatable and the research on this matter is still ever-evolving as more data is revealed and more studies are conducted.
The second point is regarding mandating the mRNA vaccines and vaccines passports. You already mentioned that you are against vaccines mandates
The forth paper was regarding the initial clinical trials of the vaccines and how they were never tested for the virus transmission making vaccine passports absurd.
@freemo Have you even bothered to read my post or look up the scientists I mentioned?
- Dr. Peter A McCullough, MD, MPH
- Citations 67165
- h-index 122
- i10-index 492
https://scholar.google.com/citations?user=LzqEaOkAAAAJ&hl=en&oi=ao
- Dr. Robert W Malone, MD
- Citations 13671
- h-index 32
- i10-index 53
https://scholar.google.com/citations?hl=en&user=Jf1bApYAAAAJ
- Dr. Aseem Malhotra
- 21 Publications 591 Citations
https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Aseem-Malhotra
I know how to determine the experts in the subject matter and the fringe doctors.
- Jeffrey Phillips Freeman
- Citations 29
- h-index 2
- i10-index 2
https://scholar.google.com/citations?hl=en&user=Gbd9WfgAAAAJ
As for peer reviewed research papers there are plenty in my original post:
>- Myocarditis after BNT162b2 mRNA Vaccine against Covid-19 in Israel
https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/nejmoa2109730
>- Cardiogenic shock revealing myocarditis after mRNA vaccination against covid-19: Case report and brief review for the first case in Morocco
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8716151/
>- Serious adverse events of special interest following mRNA COVID-19 vaccination in randomized trials in adults
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9428332/
>- Will covid-19 vaccines save lives? Current trials aren’t designed to tell us
https://www.bmj.com/content/371/bmj.m4037.long
@freemo I am not asserting anything, I asked an open question and brought dissenting opinion to the main narrative based on ever-evolving scientific research and renown scientists perspective on the matter.
If you don't like my approach that's fine, but find your responses very condescending.
I already stated there is no point continuing this conversation.
@freemo Albert Einstein has faced tremendous challenges not only in this career as a pioneer physicist but also due to his Jewish origin.
Many medical doctors are in fear to lose their job or medical license if they report adverse events or speak against the "scientific consensus".
Since you deemed questioning the scientific consensus borderline conspiracy theory, I don't see the point continuing that conversation.
@freemo I am not comparing scientific progress, I am comparing the scientific mindset e.g. Hippocratic Oath "First do no harm" ~400 BC which is still relevant to this day.
@freemo
Every generation deem it-self as modern era going back to the Greek civilization and beyond.
Reading about Electromagnetism, how the scientific consensus evolved through out the centuries and still ongoing is quite fascinating and humbling.
@freemo
The scientific consensus evolves/improve over time by making observations, data gathering, forming hypothesis, analysis and open honest scientific debate.
How many times a *scientific consensus* has been disproven partially or completely by a small group of scientists that eventually get vindicated?
I am a little bit shocked and disappointed by your response as you deemed that I am spreading *conspiracy theories*.
I can't engage in a productive conversation with you based on that premise.
I never mentioned my vaccination status, and you called me an *idiot* for not getting vaccinated, even though I got the Sinopharm shots to comply with #covid19 vaccination mandate.
Thank you Dr. Freemo for this platform #qoto and have a good day.
You proven yourself to be an idiot who can't even differentiate between propaganda and source materiel from the World Health Summit.
Not wasting my time with a dumb troll.
@jpop @freemo
Yes I confirmed your argument, mRNA technology isn't new, it has been used to create new vaccines.
If you didn't like that website you can check the source video https://youtu.be/OJFKBritLlc?t=5859
Yes mRNA isn't new it used to be called gene therapy, vaccines based on mRNA technology are new.
https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/bayer-executive-mrna-shots-are-gene-therapy-marketed-as-vaccines-to-gain-public-trust/
