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Interesting fact of the day:
Islamic medicine was well ahead of its time when it came to the treatment of the mentally ill. the Quran demanded the those with mental illness be taken care of and treated kindly, this was reflected in how doctors of the time cared for the mentally ill and very much a departure from the attitudes of other cultures at the time where the mentally ill were demonized or quite literally treated as possessed.
Here is the specific quote from the quran translated to english:
"Do not give your property which God assigned you to manage to the insane: but feed and clothe the insane with this property and tell splendid words to them." -- Sura 4:5
#History #Islam #Musslim #Quran #Religion #Psychology #medicin #history #science @Science
@freemo Yes, Islam actually WAS ahead of its time like 1000 years ago. Somehow they regressed after then. To me it shows that the more strict the doctrine, the more backwards it gets. 1000 years ago Christianity was the strict one. In some countries here it still is, and those countries are also kinda backwards in my eyes.
This is Mur 
@mur2501 Good point. Things definitely started to change around then. Christianity went from the 'Dark Ages' to the 'Age of Enlightenment'. Islam had that about 1000 years ago, they truly had a golden age going on. Mathematics, medicine, etc, that was at the pinnacle back then. Even the Christian world looked up to them.
I don't know what happened that it changed. Maybe governments changed and became more strict.
And we all know what happens to very strict societies... They won't be able to be creative and develop.That counts for ALL religions, not just Islam. That counts for ALL societies, regardless whether they're religious or not.
Repressive rule is never a good idea.
To me the Enlightenment as a concept popularized in European historiography, to what extent it was a real phenomenon, cannot be universalized and is just something unique to European society. I'm not sure people outside of Europe can really relate to the conditions or thinking that bring about this concept. (Did Europeans even relate? Or were so-called Enlightment thinkers always a privileged, minority voice in a broader society that didn't relate to them?) For one thing it relies on a belief that religion and science are opposing forces. If you mistakenly tried to project these ideas onto Muslim societies or histories you would make a few wrong assumptions like, "Muslims were less religious back when they were having their scientific golden age; now they've traded science for religion." Actually a lot of these scientific scholarly dudes 1000 years ago in the Muslim world who were advancing mathematics and medicine were also reading and writing books on theology and religious philosophy urging orthodox Islamic piety. That's just how they looked at the world back then.
But yeah I would say the single thing most Muslim countries need now more than anything is education. I wouldn't say their religion is bad or good, because whether they pray in Arabic or wear certain clothes or practice sobriety is all well and good, BUT it's the higher-level functions that need reform. (I argue this transcends mere religion.) More information and a broader worldview will help them to make the right choices. I think we're seeing this more and more now with the sudden rise of education and connectedness in the Muslim world. (Just look at Internet usage.) It's true these countries lagged behind in modernization; they suffered several major shocks in the 20th century. Things are predictably rocky, but they'll smooth out soon. A bit more stability in their lives and having their basic material needs met will help a lot of people to chill out.
@benk@pleroma.tilde.zone @freemo @mur2501 @trinsec
Very interesting conversation. I very much echo @benk@tilde.zone 's remark about how easy it is to get into "we are doing better therefore we are inherently better" and that Elightenment was the key to our current successes. To support that point, let's inspect some real historical facts in a sequence:
1. the peak period of the Islamic science achievements was [High Middle Ages](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_Middle_Ages). Se [here](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Science_in_the_medieval_Islamic_world#Significance) and [here](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_world_contributions_to_Medieval_Europe). That is, the peak time of scientific and cultural expansion was between 1000-1500 AD.
2. the peak of [Ottoman empire](https://www.britannica.com/place/Ottoman-Empire/The-peak-of-Ottoman-power-1481-1566) millitary expansion was betwen 1481-1566 and their dominance/power was projected till 17th and 18th centuries. To achieve that, they had to show a significant technological superiority. That points to a significant technological and scientific capacigty and exploitation thereof.
3. Gutenberg invented the [printing press](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Printing_press) around 1400. This is perhaps the single most important lasting invention spanning technology, society and politics till today. Behind this invention lie all the small technological and political innovations facilitating the press (think the monopoly on written word moving from the Church to citizens)
4. Columbus "discovered" Americas 1492-1504 during the [Age of Discovery](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_of_Discovery), arguably the pinnacle point of technological advancement of that time. Underpinning the voyages, there were numerous smaller technological, societal and political innovations necessary in the period before.
5. [Reformation](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reformation) came about to its full force in 1517 with Martin Luther.
6. [Age of Enlightenment](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_of_Enlightenment) came only in late 17th and 18th centuries.
This shows that:
1. muslim Ottoman empire did not quickly lose a capability to exploit science and technological innovations after the peak cultural and scientific expansion. The decline was very gradual. As the religion was well established by then, apparently the correlation between its success (as in driving force of military expansion, etc.) and its strictness is not clear.
2. European started their to exercise and exploit their technological and scientific capabilities way before the age of Enlightenment and Enlightenment (whatever exactly it meant to the contemporaries) has little to do with the vast technological expansion which happened independently already before.
3. the big political and societal upheaval of reformation came _after_ many significant technological advances unlocking European expansion were already in place.
What I am trying to say in so many words is this: it seems to me that scientific/technological/military advances and exploitations seem to be rather weakly correlated with cultural and political "revolutions/awakenings". Based on that, I would be quite suspicious to say that Muslim countries struggle in the recent centuries in the realm of science _because_ of their religion. I'd argue, they seem to be rather independent and it is something else which caused the decline. And in reverse, I personally wouldn't look at reforming the religion in order to unlock and boost technological & scientific developments either.
But again, I am just an amateur historian and a very inconsequential policy maker, so what do I know :-).
