Shamar @Shamar@qoto.org

@ekaitz_zarraga

(not ENTIRELY my fault... 🤣 )

@codewiz @Xipiryon @suetanvil@mastodon.technology

@Xipiryon

Actually, I think that this is the real answer to the @ekaitz_zarraga's question.

I don't know about #clang, but GCC's (huge, overwhelming) complexity is mostly due to the supported combinations of

- languages
- architectures
- operating systems
- optimizations
- diagnostics / debug
- internationalization

Reading this from top to bottom might give you an insight: https://gcc.gnu.org/install/configure.html

#GCC is not just a #C compiler but the #GNU Compilers Collection.

It tries to maximize the possible use cases, including several niches and corner case that are simply not considered by simpler C compilers.

Why?

Well, there is obviously an ideological aim: providing #Software #Freedom through an high quality compilers suite to everybody, no matter how peculiar are their needs (to reduce the attack surface from proprietary software).

But there is also a reasonable architectural goal: maximize the reuse of a large high quality code base that is common among the various combinations of need.

The price of this is a huge complexity, due to the tensions between different perspective on how computing should work.

I don't like such complexity (really, I hate it), but it's very short-sighted to blame it without understanding the overall vision that GCC pursuits.

@suetanvil@mastodon.technology @codewiz

@zatnosk

Because they are NOT implemented in C.

GCC is has been (re)written in C++

@ekaitz_zarraga

#Jehanne towards self-hosting.

http://jehanne.io/2020/01/06/towards-self-hosting.html

#hackers #GCC #Binutils #Chibi #Scheme @ekaitz_zarraga

@drwho

I'm not.

As long as the implemented behaviors are properly documented, undefined behaviours can be useful hooks: don't forget that C is a language designed to be used in a wide variety of use cases: portability is valuable in many of them, but sometimes is not relevant at all.

@Feufochmar @RadicalEdward

@maupao

C'è una profonda differenza fra andare dove ci sono persone in catene per liberarle e mandare persone a farsi incatenare o sponsorizzare/normalizzare i carcerieri.

Essere su #Facebook e #Twitter per raggiungere le persone che vi sono intellettualmente recluse è necessario. Ma bisogna spingerle fuori.

Non si può linkare (ovvero alimentare con i dati di tutti i visitatori che non usano uMatrix) un sistema di sorveglianza e poi non condividerne "il modo di comunicare".

L'unico modo per usare questi sistemi senza esserne usati è postare link a contenuti esterni.

@filippodb @madbob@mastodon.technology

@dpwiz

On January/February 2020 I'm going to give #GNUnet a new try with some italian friends (after a decade or so...).

May we ask you some questions if in throuble? Do you have any specific reading to suggest?

I mean beyond https://gnunet.org/en/use.html and https://docs.gnunet.org/handbook/gnunet.html

@ekaitz_zarraga

I guess we are all programming bitches, after all... 😂

First successful run of #gcc --version in #Jehanne, 🎉

...

5 seconds later, first crash of GCC in Jehanne.

I wonder why #GCC specification files use such a weird language.

https://gcc.gnu.org/onlinedocs/gcc/Spec-Files.html

@r

As for BSD we are apparently reading different pages. Here's my source https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BSD_licenses

"Some releases of BSD prior to the adoption of the 4-clause BSD license used a license that is clearly ancestral to the 4-clause BSD license. These releases include 4.3BSD-Tahoe (1988) and Net/1 (1989)."

Plan 9 had a more complex (and somewhat sad) history, because LPL 1 was "almost free but not quite". Yet the point was that operating systems exists that were developed independently of GNU tools.

As of today Plan 9 (and in particular #9front) is probably the only general purpose operating system out there who can really claim to be GNU-free (and it somewhat does it).

Even #Windows today comes with several #GNU tools.

So in a way I think it's fair on GNU side to resist to this new wave of embrace, extend and extinguish.

@yolo @georgia @leyonhjelm @freemo