@Pat
I cant speak to the previous content you mention as i may have missed it. I seem to recall him saying he was reading mein kampf but that it was not an indication of him supporting the message.

As for the word being harmful in every situation i cant agree, the following woulda be an example where its not harmful: "Shaniqua was called a nigger by a racist today and this is uncalled for, we cant accept that language. I strongly condemn the use of that words towards blacks!". In this context i woukd say not only is not harmful but it is being used positively to condemn racism. As far as i could tell this is more or less the way tripu used it and also the way in which joe roagan used it.

@tripu @Sphinx @trinsec

@freemo @tripu @Sphinx @trinsec

I didn't say "every situation", I said in "nearly" every context. That quote you gave could have been, "Shaniqua was called <the n-word> by a racist today which is uncalled for. We can't accept that language. I strongly condemn the use of that word."

The only time I think it could be used is to explain it to someone who has never heard the word before, if someone asks what "the n-word" is. And then it should be done in a non-public setting.

In any case, that's not even what he did. He used it as a tag for God's sake, and posted a video with people saying it over and over again without context. And he did it just to get a reaction to the use of the word.

And I'd prefer if you don't use that word again either, even in a quote.

@Pat
I cant view the videos here in egypt so i cant comment on if the context ia acceptable.

I can say that in any direct communication with you id avoid the use of the word in any context simply as a sign of respect i can not promise to do so in a general or public context. I feel saying "the n-word" rather than the actual word is an unhealthy approach to the problem. Respect comes from intent, not the mere utterance of a word. Not only do i find it acceptable to use the word in a context such as that, i find it preferable.

I think we need to fight against a society where we attack people without awareness of the context and using the word in a descriptive way is perfectly fine and outside of conversations directly between us i will have no problem using ot descriptively as i have in the past.

@tripu @Sphinx @trinsec

@freemo @tripu @Sphinx @trinsec

If you haven't seen the video, now I understand why we're in different places on this. He posted three toots, as I remember, replying to his own original toot, so that each one appeared in the local timeline. The last one (which is the first that someone sees as they read the timeline, was that horrible video, without much (or any) context, as I remember. And, as I said, he used the word as a tag.

In any case, we've got an asshole disrupting this conversation, so...

You understand my position.

@Pat
Ahh yes it could be once i see the video my stance may change. Either way i respect your decision.

@tripu @Sphinx @trinsec

@Pat @freemo @tripu @Sphinx @trinsec You should really take a step back, analyze what you just said, and please try to understand why it's incredibly retarded and why you should slit your own throat. Maybe headbutt a table saw.

@wildgoose

That rudeness isnt going to get you anything productive out of the conversation.

@trinsec @Sphinx @tripu @Pat

@freemo @Sphinx @trinsec

@Pat and I seem to have basic disagreements about rules of engagement, acceptable speech, and logical reasoning, which we aren't going to solve. We are not going to convince each other. Definitely not when one side is literally blocked by the other. (I absolutely respect his decision to block me.)

For passers-by, and because I keep on feeling implicitly accused of bigotry, lack of sensitivity, or worse: **context and intent matters**. I insist on this because that basic rule keeps resurfacing in the discussion (🧵):

1/5

It's amazing I have to remind anyone in 2022, but **linking to, fav'ing/boosting, or following, something or someone, does _not_ imply complete endorsement of every aspect of that thing or that person**. (Sometimes we even share or highlight precisely for the _opposite_ reason.)

I linked to two videos because I saw something useful in them, in the context of the broader discussion (the #JoeRogan controversy). And no, what I saw useful was not gratuitously chaining utterances of a certain word (that's stupid per se), but:

* that one video showcased that the reaction to Rogan was inconsistent with previous reactions to other public figures committing the same “sin”; and
* that the other video showed that Rogan's views on politics, race, gender, inequality, etc are actually very different from what his critics are saying.

2/5

The fact that I did read #MeinKampf is utterly irrelevant here. Anyone can read [my post about it](https://blog.tripu.info/mein-kampf/).

I think dropping in that bare fact like that in our conversation is rather dishonest.

[I did read #TheCommunistManifesto](https://www.goodreads.com/review/show/1912006087), too. Guess what? I completely disagree with _both_ authors!

Ditto about my previous disagreements with @Pat regarding other topics.

3/5

I tag a lot in my toots as a way for my future self to find ideas or conversations. In that context, the fact that I tagged that specific word (too) is meaningless (and I bet @Pat _knew_ that).

4/5

> _“As to #intent, no one can see into someone else's thoughts to know for sure.”_

Sure. That's why we have the [Principle of #Charity](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Principle_of_charity) (ie, when in doubt, assume the best intentions in others).

Also, notice that the exact same proposition (“no one can see into someone else's thoughts to know for sure”) would exonerate _me_ from any accusation of #bigotry or lack of sensitivity, since I can't possibly know for sure what other people think, how they will interpret what I say, or how they will feel.

Thus (again): #context, and #PrincipleOfCharity.

5/5

@tripu

I agree with your points, and i think its ashame pat didnt engage with you rather than jumping the gun. I havent seen the videos so incant comment on the full context, but i see no problem with the post of yours i read or your choice to read mein kampf. In fact id say anyone who cares about racism as a social issue should feel an obligation yo read mein kampf. Understanding the things and people we dislike is an important step in addressing those issues.